From ajith@nsc.ernet.in Tue Oct 1 09:51:31 2002
From: ajith@nsc.ernet.in (Ajith Kumar)
Date: Tue, 01 Oct 2002 15:21:31 +0530
Subject: [Fsf-friends] Register Your Protest
Message-ID: <3D997023.70189F7A@nsc.ernet.in>
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Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
Hello,
Register your protest against the inclusion of a products from a
Multinational Company
in the IT@school syllabus by sending mail to the following.
The Executive Director
IT @ SCHOOL Project
SCERT Buildings
Poojapura
Thiruvananthapuram-12
email: itschool@asianetindia.com
Also ask your friends, especially school/college teachers, who are
familiar with GNU/Linux to do the same.
regards
ajith
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Hello,
Register your protest against the inclusion of a products from a Multinational
Company
in the IT@school
syllabus by sending mail to the following.
The Executive Director
IT @ SCHOOL Project
SCERT Buildings
Poojapura
Thiruvananthapuram-12
email: itschool@asianetindia.com
Also ask your friends, especially school/college teachers, who are familiar
with GNU/Linux to do the same.
regards
ajith
--------------3EAF22BA2EA39C24031F8B4A--
From nagarjun@hbcse.tifr.res.in Wed Oct 2 07:33:48 2002
From: nagarjun@hbcse.tifr.res.in (Nagarjuna G.)
Date: Wed, 2 Oct 2002 13:03:48 +0530
Subject: [Fsf-friends] Good News!
Message-ID: <20021002073348.GA15337@hbcse.tifr.res.in>
A very good news. I am just coming from a meeting with
Mr. M.S. Sridhar (of Cyberscape Multimedia Limited) and Prof. Jitender
Shaw (VJTI, Mumbai). Sridhar is releasing the Indian Language TTF
fonts (more than hundred) under GPL today the the birthday of Mahatma
Gandhi. He has fonts for all the languages. The press release and
release note will be posted by evening. I wanted to break the news to
all of you. We have been trying to have this meeting happen, but it
happened today. The fonts will be putup on FSF-India's website for
download, as well as their companies web site. The details will be
announced soon. I will put it up on the FSF site as soon as I get the
CD. We can also put them up at indic-computing site at sourceforge.
Now the task is to make use of the set of TTF fonts and solve the
immediate problem of encoding and rendering with TTF fonts in all the
Indian Languages and release the GNU/Linux distro with GNOME
applications enabled by January 26. The next task is to convert these
fonts to Open Type fonts as soon as possible.
Mr. Sridhar is only anticipating from the free software community the
technical know how so that their company will also start developing
applications under GNU/Linux OS, and also help us solve the problem of
converting TTF to OTF.
I hope this news will add momentum to the efforts of localization. I
wish to thank on behalf of the free software community Sridhar and
also Jitender Shaw for initiating this process and making this happen.
I think this gesture of Sridhar will be a slap on the face of CDAC and
other both Govt and private companies who are refusing to share such
resources.
Nagarjuna
From arun@gnu.org.in Wed Oct 2 08:21:29 2002
From: arun@gnu.org.in (Arun M)
Date: 02 Oct 2002 13:51:29 +0530
Subject: [Fsf-friends] Good News!
In-Reply-To: <20021002073348.GA15337@hbcse.tifr.res.in>
References: <20021002073348.GA15337@hbcse.tifr.res.in>
Message-ID: <1033546894.508.4.camel@debian-demo>
> A very good news. I am just coming from a meeting with
> Mr. M.S. Sridhar (of Cyberscape Multimedia Limited) and Prof. Jitender
> Shaw (VJTI, Mumbai). Sridhar is releasing the Indian Language TTF
> fonts (more than hundred) under GPL today the the birthday of Mahatma
> Gandhi. He has fonts for all the languages. The press release and
> release note will be posted by evening. I wanted to break the news to
This is simply fantastic. Waiting for the release of fonts.
From unmadindu@Softhome.net Wed Oct 2 08:52:31 2002
From: unmadindu@Softhome.net (Sayamindu Dasgupta)
Date: 02 Oct 2002 14:22:31 +0530
Subject: [Fsf-friends] Good News!
In-Reply-To: <20021002073348.GA15337@hbcse.tifr.res.in>
References: <20021002073348.GA15337@hbcse.tifr.res.in>
Message-ID: <1033548762.1496.9.camel@peacefulaction.org>
On Wed, 2002-10-02 at 13:03, Nagarjuna G. wrote:
>
> A very good news. I am just coming from a meeting with
> Mr. M.S. Sridhar (of Cyberscape Multimedia Limited) and Prof. Jitender
> Shaw (VJTI, Mumbai). Sridhar is releasing the Indian Language TTF
> fonts (more than hundred) under GPL today the the birthday of Mahatma
> Gandhi. He has fonts for all the languages. The press release and
> release note will be posted by evening. I wanted to break the news to
> all of you. We have been trying to have this meeting happen, but it
> happened today. The fonts will be putup on FSF-India's website for
> download, as well as their companies web site. The details will be
> announced soon. I will put it up on the FSF site as soon as I get the
> CD. We can also put them up at indic-computing site at sourceforge.
>
> Now the task is to make use of the set of TTF fonts and solve the
> immediate problem of encoding and rendering with TTF fonts in all the
> Indian Languages and release the GNU/Linux distro with GNOME
> applications enabled by January 26. The next task is to convert these
> fonts to Open Type fonts as soon as possible.
>
GREAT!!!
this would be a BIG help for all of us out here
-(BIG) cheers-
sdg
--
Sayamindu Dasgupta
http://www.peacefulaction.org/sayamindu/
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From arun@gnu.org.in Wed Oct 2 08:56:37 2002
From: arun@gnu.org.in (Arun M)
Date: 02 Oct 2002 14:26:37 +0530
Subject: [Fsf-friends] Register Your Protest
In-Reply-To: <3D997023.70189F7A@nsc.ernet.in>
References: <3D997023.70189F7A@nsc.ernet.in>
Message-ID: <1033549007.507.31.camel@debian-demo>
> Register your protest against the inclusion of a products from a
> Multinational Company
> in the IT@school syllabus by sending mail to the following.
Some of FSF India activists are working to address the issue and made
some progress. Director of IT@School has asked for a meeting to discuss
the issue further, hope it will happen next week.
Regards
Arun.
From fred@bytesforall.org Wed Oct 2 05:19:37 2002
From: fred@bytesforall.org (Frederick Noronha)
Date: Wed, 2 Oct 2002 10:49:37 +0530 (IST)
Subject: [Fsf-friends] Ten ways to promote communication within a GNU/LUG
Message-ID:
Thanks to Shyam Kumar.s for his feedback and
constructive criticism on an earlier version of this posting. Responsibility
for errors, or conceptual flaws continues to be mine. Send in your feedback
to fred at bytesforall dot org. FN
COMMENT: Ten ways to promote communication within a GNU/LUG...
* Build a network of GNU/LUG speakers, who are capable to speak and
evangelise on the power of GNU/Linux. It's important to list
who's available to speak on what subject, so that the interests
of newbies are catered to. Technical issues are imporant; but
issues like the philisophy of Free Software needs to be
adequately understood. The power of sharing and helping one
another also can be emphasised.
* List readily available GNU/Linux software, where
available, and under what terms it can be
shared freely and without artificial restrictions.
* List GNU/LUG members and contact details. Group communications
through GNU/LUG mailing-lists build a self-learning environment
for all, but sometimes one-to-one correspondence may be more
apt in order to (i) avoid mailing-list overload (ii) address
issues which might not be of wider group interest.
* Expanding numbers is important. It helps GNU/LUGs attain
critical mass. At the same time, it's equally important
to take care of one another's learning needs, and the
requirement of building a caring, sharing environment.
Sharing and community building could prove more valuable
than mere technical excellence, as the latter could lead
to stagnation and elitism along its trajectory.
* Report regularly on GNU/LUG meetings. This build
bridges to those not present.
* Plan for GNU/LUG meetings in advance. Meetings with
outlined agendas and scheduled talks could attract more
people than vague, no-agenda meetings. Meetings should
also take care of newbie interests, including talks and
subjects that would help to build interest among those who
are not so well-versed with GNU/Linux.
* If nothing else works, trying to build more
mini-GNU/LUGs in your area.
From mssridhar@vsnl.com Wed Oct 2 01:47:46 2002
From: mssridhar@vsnl.com (M.S.Sridhar)
Date: Wed, 02 Oct 2002 07:17:46 +0530
Subject: [Fsf-friends] Indian Language Fonts
Message-ID: <3D9A5042.49F40A9B@vsnl.com>
Release Notes:
M/S Cyberscape Multimedia Limited, Mumbai, developers of Akruti
Software for Indian Languages, are here by releasing a set of TTF
fonts for nine Indian scripts (Devanagari, Gujarati, Telugu, Tamil,
Malayalam, Kannada, Bengali, Oriya, and Gurumukhi) under GNU General
Public License (GPL). The fonts will be made available through Free
Software Foundation of India and will be uploaded at the web site of
FSF-India (www.gnu.org.in), indic-computing@sourceforge.net and also
at the Akruti site (http://www.akruti.com).
For any further information or assistance please contact
mssridhar@vsnl.com.
From rms@gnu.org Wed Oct 2 19:24:06 2002
From: rms@gnu.org (Richard Stallman)
Date: Wed, 02 Oct 2002 15:24:06 -0400
Subject: [Fsf-friends] Re: Good News!
In-Reply-To: <20021002073348.GA15337@hbcse.tifr.res.in>
(nagarjun@hbcse.tifr.res.in)
References: <20021002073348.GA15337@hbcse.tifr.res.in>
Message-ID:
This is indeed very good news.
From ckra@vsnl.net Fri Oct 4 02:57:20 2002
From: ckra@vsnl.net (CK Raju)
Date: Fri, 4 Oct 2002 08:27:20 +0530
Subject: [Fsf-friends] Fwd: Govt Stand on Linux
Message-ID:
On one hand the Government says that it has decentralised and transferred
most of the powers to local bodies, and here it appears to be strengthening
its hold.
CK Raju
KILA
---------- Forwarded Message ----------
Subject: letter
Date: 3 Oct 2002 17:28:43 -0000
From: "ramanunni s sivasankaran"
To: ckraju@zyberway.com
I invite your kind attention to the resolution adopted by the
Pattanchery Grama Panchayat about the installation of Linux in
the computer during the month of January this year. In this
regard we had sent a letter to the secretary to the government for
the approval of Linux installation in the computers.
The additional secretary for secretary department of local
administration in his letter ltr.no 31914/02 dla dt.25.9.02 to the
secretary pattanchery grama Panchayat has strictly objected the
installation of Linux as operating system in the computer when it
is being installed in the Panchayat instead of windows.
The secretary pattanchery grama Panchayat called on me over the
phone yesterday and informed this fact to me. This is for your
information please.
Nothing more at present.
Thanking you,
(Ramanunni)
-------------------------------------------------------
From ajith@nsc.ernet.in Fri Oct 4 03:27:47 2002
From: ajith@nsc.ernet.in (Ajith Kumar)
Date: Fri, 04 Oct 2002 08:57:47 +0530
Subject: [Fsf-friends] Fwd: Govt Stand on Linux
References:
Message-ID: <3D9D0AB3.986F7447@nsc.ernet.in>
> ---------- Forwarded Message ----------
>
> Subject: letter
> Date: 3 Oct 2002 17:28:43 -0000
> From: "ramanunni s sivasankaran"
> To: ckraju@zyberway.com
>
> I invite your kind attention to the resolution adopted by the
> Pattanchery Grama Panchayat about the installation of Linux in
> the computer during the month of January this year. In this
> regard we had sent a letter to the secretary to the government for
> the approval of Linux installation in the computers.
>
> The additional secretary for secretary department of local
> administration in his letter ltr.no 31914/02 dla dt.25.9.02 to the
> secretary pattanchery grama Panchayat has strictly objected the
> installation of Linux as operating system in the computer when it
> is being installed in the Panchayat instead of windows.
Somebody from Trivandrum should meet this secretary and ask to justify
his order. Either he is ignorant about IT or he is playing in the hands of
some
vested interest.
The adamant stands of any official for MSWindows has to be seen in the light
of
the recently exposed "Modi Xerox bribery scandal". Our buerocracy is known
for
corruption. All these hurdles on the path of Free Softeware is pointing
towards the
necessity of a grassroot level awareness program.
ajith
From suraj@symonds.net Fri Oct 4 05:15:20 2002
From: suraj@symonds.net (Suraj Kumar)
Date: Fri, 4 Oct 2002 10:45:20 +0530
Subject: [Fsf-friends] Fwd: Govt Stand on Linux
In-Reply-To:
References:
Message-ID: <20021004051520.GB24981@chennailug.org>
[snip]
ckr> regard we had sent a letter to the secretary to the government for
ckr> the approval of Linux installation in the computers.
^^^^^
When you talk to such a large body, like the govt please use a more
accurate term. Call it 'GNU/Linux'. Irrespective of whether the order
comes through or not, we should educate the government and remove wrong
ideas that they have. most government 'IT' ppl still believe that this
OS was started in 1991 by a student as a hobby.
-Suraj
--
+---------------------------------------------------+
| A trader is true to himself, who weighs |
| his interests, even with his customers |
| (equity & uprightness - 10), Thirukkural |
+--------------------------------------+
From ajith@nsc.ernet.in Fri Oct 4 11:37:20 2002
From: ajith@nsc.ernet.in (Ajith Kumar)
Date: Fri, 04 Oct 2002 17:07:20 +0530
Subject: [Fsf-friends] Fwd: Govt Stand on Linux
References: <20021004073950.49331.qmail@web8006.mail.in.yahoo.com>
Message-ID: <3D9D7D70.B4C7563B@nsc.ernet.in>
pandarinathan raman wrote:
> It is highly irregular to pass comment about officials
> without knowing full context. It could have been
> rejected probably some existing applications have to
> be ported.
What is the present level of computerization in the govt. offices.
Does it go anything beyond MSOffice.
If a panchayat is capable of handling its requirements using GNU/Linux,
preventing it by an order from Trivandrum is sheer misuse of power.
Once I had the following experience. We we met the mayor of a corporation
, that was computerizing some records, to talk about Free Software and he
directed us to the officer handling it. When we pointed out about the
cost savings the curt response
from the officer was "we have enough funds from the government".
This is the prevailing mentality. If money is there, just spend it. If
somebody
under you come up with something better , reject it without assigning any
reason.
If linux is rejected due to the lack of some application, he should have
point out that reason. Sending an order "strictly objecting to installing
linux" is
not a sensible thing to do. Such reply comes from the attitude " I do not
have to
explain any reason since I have power"
I am also a govt. employee and working in a place where more that 100
machines
running GNU/Linux for word processing, communication, databases,
scientific computing and
control applications. Fortunately it not under an official who rejects
something without reason.
>
> We can progress by our actions and not by accusing
> others or by emotional outbursts. For real success in
> govt sector you should show some successful sites in
> India entirely running on FS, which I think are
> reallly rare.
The decision makers in the govt. also should keep their eyes open.
They should interact with academics in places like engg. colleges and IITs.
At least they should see what is happening around the world.
If they do not do any of these, at least they should not issue orders
"strictly objecting
to something without assigning any reason" . A nations fate cannot be
decided by the
information provided by sales representatives.
If somebody does that, one can always suspect the motive.
ajith
>
From raamanp@yahoo.co.in Fri Oct 4 13:07:49 2002
From: raamanp@yahoo.co.in (=?iso-8859-1?q?pandarinathan=20raman?=)
Date: Fri, 4 Oct 2002 14:07:49 +0100 (BST)
Subject: [Fsf-friends] Fwd: Govt Stand on Linux
In-Reply-To: <3D9D7D70.B4C7563B@nsc.ernet.in>
Message-ID: <20021004130749.69381.qmail@web8005.mail.in.yahoo.com>
Well I am also Govt Employee and implementing Linux
in 500beded railway hospital. My point is, with
sketchy details
like given in the post let us not pass comments.
I think its time we teach software freedom than
preach.
Unless we make effort to show successful installations
we can never make inroads in any sector. I also faced
similar situations with few people in Railways. But
the attitude should be educating them than casting
aspirations. Well I too have very good bosses, who
have cut down proprietory softwares at my instance
without murmur. It is not the proposal or note that
matters in decision, but the people behind the
proposal.
It is imperative on our part to create awarness,
specifically in the top level and this can be done
only by successful installtions in existing computer
centeres
We can achieve anything by emotional outbursts
Raman
--- Ajith Kumar wrote: >
pandarinathan raman wrote:
>
> > It is highly irregular to pass comment about
> officials
> > without knowing full context. It could have been
> > rejected probably some existing applications have
> to
> > be ported.
>
> What is the present level of computerization in the
> govt. offices.
> Does it go anything beyond MSOffice.
> If a panchayat is capable of handling its
> requirements using GNU/Linux,
> preventing it by an order from Trivandrum is sheer
> misuse of power.
>
> Once I had the following experience. We we met the
> mayor of a corporation
>
> , that was computerizing some records, to talk about
> Free Software and he
> directed us to the officer handling it. When we
> pointed out about the
> cost savings the curt response
> from the officer was "we have enough funds from the
> government".
> This is the prevailing mentality. If money is there,
> just spend it. If
> somebody
> under you come up with something better , reject it
> without assigning any
> reason.
>
> If linux is rejected due to the lack of some
> application, he should have
> point out that reason. Sending an order "strictly
> objecting to installing
> linux" is
> not a sensible thing to do. Such reply comes from
> the attitude " I do not
> have to
> explain any reason since I have power"
>
> I am also a govt. employee and working in a place
> where more that 100
> machines
> running GNU/Linux for word processing,
> communication, databases,
> scientific computing and
> control applications. Fortunately it not under an
> official who rejects
> something without reason.
>
> >
> > We can progress by our actions and not by accusing
> > others or by emotional outbursts. For real success
> in
> > govt sector you should show some successful sites
> in
> > India entirely running on FS, which I think are
> > reallly rare.
>
> The decision makers in the govt. also should keep
> their eyes open.
> They should interact with academics in places like
> engg. colleges and IITs.
>
> At least they should see what is happening around
> the world.
> If they do not do any of these, at least they should
> not issue orders
> "strictly objecting
> to something without assigning any reason" . A
> nations fate cannot be
> decided by the
> information provided by sales representatives.
> If somebody does that, one can always suspect the
> motive.
>
> ajith
>
> >
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> Fsf-friends mailing list
> Fsf-friends@mm.gnu.org.in
> http://mm.gnu.org.in/mailman/listinfo/fsf-friends
________________________________________________________________________
Missed your favourite TV serial last night? Try the new, Yahoo! TV.
visit http://in.tv.yahoo.com
From psk"
Hi hackers,
The works for starting flag(FsF Local Activists Group)s are on the
way. I mailed rms & as he advised we met Arun. The activities are
currently going on by planning how the groups should be working.
The current plans are
*Arranging awareness classes of FsF both ethical & technical
*Arrange the local activists meetings monthly
*Promote the FsF distributions
*Sale & support of FsF softwares & Documentations
*Find out and use the developers for developing Free Software
*Each flag is planned in such a way that they support Other Free
Softwares (including other OS's)as well as the GNU/Linux
*Each meeting will be having the discussions about the current
activities in Freedom world & technical world of FsF
*Cooperate with the lugs for promoting the GNU/Linux environment &
support them to think about the freedom
*Seminars on any of the papers either in the ethical (better) or
the technical
*** MOST importantly maintain a Free Software journel containg the
articles of budding FsF'ians and FsF 'Gurus' from allover the
country.
The journel may be an Online One for atleast a few issues & by
analysing the stuff we can plan for a printed one
We have started the primary activities at alappuzha district of
Kerala. We are on the way to find out more members from alappuzha
& now it's a 58 member group untill today. The activities are
based around a GNU software training computer institute (JRS
Academy*) and with the help of students from Cochin University
College of Engineering Kuttanad. (Hope similar groups start all
over the country.)
Now we need the support of all the Free Software Community to make
up official rules for all the flags* & further advices &
guidelines.
The better thing will be deciding the formalization only after
an active chat in the mailing list.
***The articles are invited from all over the country & 'll be
better if in TeX format. Send them to
praveenskhan@rediffmail.com***
We people are having a daily meeting now & are planning to start
the official functioning after the Pooja* (14th & 15th)days.
Hope we'll be forming an idea before that
HTH
-psk
__________________________________________________________
Give your Company an email address like
ravi @ ravi-exports.com. Sign up for Rediffmail Pro today!
Know more. http://www.rediffmailpro.com/signup/
From paivakil@vsnl.net Fri Oct 4 14:35:49 2002
From: paivakil@vsnl.net (Mahesh T Pai)
Date: Fri, 04 Oct 2002 20:05:49 +0530
Subject: [Fsf-friends] Fwd: Govt Stand on Linux
References: <20021004130749.69381.qmail@web8005.mail.in.yahoo.com>
Message-ID: <3D9DA745.6000605@vsnl.net>
pandarinathan raman wrote:
> Unless we make effort to show successful installations
> we can never make inroads in any sector.
(snip)
> It is imperative on our part to create awarness,
> specifically in the top level and this can be done
> only by successful installtions in existing computer
> centeres
Pandarinathan, how can you show a successful installation unless you
are permitted to make one? Your argument will put us in proverbial
egg and hen situation.
Reg. statements about govt servants, I do agree with Sri Pandarinathan
to some extent. But, it appears that in the case pointed out by Sri
Raju, the govt. is standing in way of adopting free-s/w. Here, the
problem is slightly different.
Will somebody please send me a copy of the Secy's order?
Regards,
Mahesh T Pai.
From ckra@vsnl.net Fri Oct 4 17:52:10 2002
From: ckra@vsnl.net (CK Raju)
Date: Fri, 4 Oct 2002 23:22:10 +0530
Subject: [Fsf-friends] Fwd: Govt Stand on Linux
In-Reply-To: <3D9DA745.6000605@vsnl.net>
References: <20021004130749.69381.qmail@web8005.mail.in.yahoo.com> <3D9DA745.6000605@vsnl.net>
Message-ID:
> Will somebody please send me a copy of the Secy's order?
You can quote the reference number and date from the forwarded mail of
Ramanunni. I think this matter should be taken up with the Member Secretary,
State Planning Board, Shri SM Vijayanand IAS
(secretary@keralaplanningboard.org) who can interpret the legal validity of
the Additional Secretary's (of Local Self Government Department - Rural)
order vis-a-vis the Panchayat's resolution (whereby it had explicitly stated,
that adoption of proprietary technology would make the institution
"dependant" and has deeper economic ramifications). Considering the fact that
local self governing institutions like Panchayats have been empowered to pass
resolutions and bring to the notice of the Government, any issue that has to
be reviewed seriously, the Additional Secretary's order appears to be a
conscious one (it has taken well over 8 months from the time the Panchayat
sent the resolution and reply was obtained).
The forum should decide on how to proceed. I think it would be wrong to leave
the Panchayat high and dry. Ramanunni has been posted out to another
Panchayat, but he still can maintain link with the Panchayat.
CK Raju
From ckra@vsnl.net Fri Oct 4 18:10:48 2002
From: ckra@vsnl.net (CK Raju)
Date: Fri, 4 Oct 2002 23:40:48 +0530
Subject: [Fsf-friends] Fwd: Govt Stand on Linux
In-Reply-To: <20021004130749.69381.qmail@web8005.mail.in.yahoo.com>
References: <20021004130749.69381.qmail@web8005.mail.in.yahoo.com>
Message-ID:
On Friday 04 October 2002 18:37, pandarinathan raman wrote:
> I think its time we teach software freedom than
> preach.
> Unless we make effort to show successful installations
> we can never make inroads in any sector. I also faced
> similar situations with few people in Railways. But
> the attitude should be educating them than casting
> aspirations. Well I too have very good bosses, who
The situation is not that easy here. It appears to be a planned move, a well
planned one. In so far as the argument of setting up a system on Linux goes,
the District Panchayat of Ernakulam had a project called EIID (now
rechristened OSS) that had applications built over Linux for the Grama
Panchayats, way back in 2000. The project itself had been funded by District
Panchayat (more details might turn up on a google search).
> It is imperative on our part to create awarness,
> specifically in the top level and this can be done
> only by successful installtions in existing computer
> centeres
Ramanunni had been trained in one out the twenty five odd awareness courses
conducted in this area at this institute, setup for training the local
bodies in Kerala. That process still continues. Hence we could easily start
building up our case for taking a shot at the Government machinery.
CK Raju
Kerala Institute of Local Administration.
From klak@giasbm01.vsnl.net.in Sat Oct 5 10:43:25 2002
From: klak@giasbm01.vsnl.net.in (Khuzaima A. Lakdawala)
Date: 05 Oct 2002 16:13:25 +0530
Subject: [Fsf-friends] Flag
In-Reply-To: <20021004161730.31324.qmail@webmail8.rediffmail.com>
References: <20021004161730.31324.qmail@webmail8.rediffmail.com>
Message-ID: <86lm5dtbci.fsf@home.this-is-not-a-domain.in>
On 4 Oct 2002 16:17:30 -0000, "psk" wrote:
> The works for starting flag(FsF Local Activists Group)s are on the
[...]
> *** MOST importantly maintain a Free Software journel containg the
> articles of budding FsF'ians and FsF 'Gurus' from allover the country.
> The journel may be an Online One for atleast a few issues & by
> analysing the stuff we can plan for a printed one
Such an online forum already exists: http://forum.gnu.org.in
> Now we need the support of all the Free Software Community to make up
> official rules for all the flags* & further advices & guidelines.
> The better thing will be deciding the formalization only after an
> active chat in the mailing list.
No need to formalize it with "rules" etc. You will probably get caught
up in your own mini-bureaucracy :) Isn't FSF India enough of a formal
organisation to work under? Why add another layer of formality with
"official rules" etc? Not a good idea.
Just do what you want to do in as informal a manner as possible. When
you do need an "official" banner, the banner of FSF India is
enough. You don't need another one.
Regards,
Khuzaima
From fred@bytesforall.org Sat Oct 5 17:35:25 2002
From: fred@bytesforall.org (Frederick Noronha)
Date: Sat, 5 Oct 2002 23:05:25 +0530 (IST)
Subject: [Fsf-friends] Wanted: Links about GNU/Linux in Asia...
Message-ID:
I am currently trying to locate more information on the role that
GNU/Linux is playing in Asia, and would be grateful if you could offer me
some clues on where to look.
In particular, would be grateful for (i) URLs of any useful GNU/Linux
websites in Asia (ii) email addresses of key persons play a role in the
Free/Libre Software and Open Source domain in countries of this region
(iii) mailing lists that are active and innovative in this field (iv) any
useful contributions to GNU/Linux coming out of Asia.
Thanks so much for your help,
Frederick
PS: Please visit my recently updated site at http://linuxinindia.pitas.com
--
Frederick Noronha * Freelance Journalist * Goa * India 832.409490 / 409783
BYTESFORALL www.bytesforall.org * GNU-LINUX http://linuxinindia.pitas.com
Email fred@bytesforall.org * Mobile +9822 122436 (Goa) * Saligao Goa India
Writing with a difference... on what makes *the* difference
From fred@bytesforall.org Sun Oct 6 16:22:46 2002
From: fred@bytesforall.org (Frederick Noronha)
Date: Sun, 6 Oct 2002 21:52:46 +0530 (IST)
Subject: [Fsf-friends] Console frontend to wvdial
Message-ID:
This msg is from Asterix Baron in Goa. -FN
---------- Forwarded message ----------
hi all
heres a set of scripts that act as a front end to wvdial ...
console based
it gives u a bar of traffic on ppp interface
ideal for the 'console happy' ;)
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/ilug-goa/files/inet.zip
if u have any probs with these hack them to suit ur taste
adieus
cheerio
b2
p.s. Does anyone have any interesting scripts to share ???
p.s. Is anyone interested in forming an (e)group ...
BCLU - Brotherhood of Command Line Users ???
to share the power of the command line
From Kanti Jadia"
>Hi hackers,
>The works for starting flag(FsF Local Activists Group)s are on
>the
>way. I mailed rms & as he advised we met Arun. The activities
>are
>currently going on by planning how the groups should be
>working.
The need for GNU user groups/Free Software user groups is true.
People need local group to discuss and implement free software.
I am facing similar problems here in NAGPUR(Maharashtra) also.
> The current plans are
>*Arranging awareness classes of FsF both ethical & technical
>*Arrange the local activists meetings monthly
>*Promote the FsF distributions
>*Sale & support of FsF softwares & Documentations
>*Find out and use the developers for developing Free Software
>*Each flag is planned in such a way that they support Other
>Free
>Softwares (including other OS's)as well as the GNU/Linux
>*Each meeting will be having the discussions about the current
>activities in Freedom world & technical world of FsF
>*Cooperate with the lugs for promoting the GNU/Linux environment
>&
>support them to think about the freedom
>*Seminars on any of the papers either in the ethical (better)
>or
>the technical
>*** MOST importantly maintain a Free Software journel containg
>the
>articles of budding FsF'ians and FsF 'Gurus' from allover the
>country.
>The journel may be an Online One for atleast a few issues & by
>analysing the stuff we can plan for a printed one
forum.gnu.org.in
>We have started the primary activities at alappuzha district of
>Kerala. We are on the way to find out more members from
>alappuzha
>& now it's a 58 member group untill today. The activities are
>based around a GNU software training computer institute (JRS
>Academy*) and with the help of students from Cochin University
>College of Engineering Kuttanad. (Hope similar groups start all
>over the country.)
It is true that local Colleges and Institutions can be the hub for
such groups.
>Now we need the support of all the Free Software Community to
>make
>up official rules for all the flags* & further advices &
>guidelines.
The flags can be organized under the FSF-India banner and to me it
seems the best.
Rules /Guidelines need to be formulated so that proper
communication can be established.The laws of the land also need to
be seen so as to get Tax Free donations and other benefits for
FSF-India and the FLAG's
or FLUG's (Free Software User Groups)
> The better thing will be deciding the formalization only
>after
>an active chat in the mailing list.
I would suggest a mailing list of fsf-india itself to cater to the
FLUG's.
This is emphasized since mailing lists at present tend to be a
better methed due to bandwidth and other limitations in online
forums.
Articles can and should be posted to the forum so as to make the
available at all times and an easy to read format.
>***The articles are invited from all over the country & 'll be
>better if in TeX format. Send them to
>praveenskhan@rediffmail.com***
>We people are having a daily meeting now & are planning to
>start
>the official functioning after the Pooja* (14th & 15th)days.
> Hope we'll be forming an idea before that
> HTH
> -psk
Regards
Kanti Jadia
From klak@giasbm01.vsnl.net.in Mon Oct 7 06:03:37 2002
From: klak@giasbm01.vsnl.net.in (Khuzaima A. Lakdawala)
Date: 07 Oct 2002 11:33:37 +0530
Subject: [Fsf-friends] RE:flag
In-Reply-To: <20021006183020.5502.qmail@webmail8.rediffmail.com>
References: <20021006183020.5502.qmail@webmail8.rediffmail.com>
Message-ID: <86elb2dbuu.fsf@home.this-is-not-a-domain.in>
On 6 Oct 2002 18:30:20 -0000, "Kanti Jadia" wrote:
> The need for GNU user groups/Free Software user groups is true.
> People need local group to discuss and implement free software.
> I am facing similar problems here in NAGPUR(Maharashtra) also.
Yes, local Free Software User Groups are indeed the way to go. But in
an *informal* manner. Formalizing such groups with "rules" followed by
"office bearers" etc. simply complicates and bureaucratizes
matters. One formal entity, the FSF India umbrella organisation, is
enough.
FSUGs can serve the purpose of local group discussions and activities
quite well without becoming formal entities. You don't need any
resources to start one. Websites and mailing lists can be set up for
free on many places on the Internet. Please see the following examples
of Indian FSUGs:
http://www.geocities.com/fsug_calicut
http://www.symonds.net/~fsug-kochi
> I would suggest a mailing list of fsf-india itself to cater to the
> FLUG's.
Do you mean mailing lists for individual FSUGs or one list for
coordination between FSUGs? As I said, FSUGs can set up their own
mailing lists without any problems. As for the latter, well, it would
be better to keep all such advocacy activities confined to fsf-friends
to make fsf-friends more important and relevant!
Regards,
--
Khuzaima
From klak@giasbm01.vsnl.net.in Mon Oct 7 07:01:49 2002
From: klak@giasbm01.vsnl.net.in (Khuzaima A. Lakdawala)
Date: 07 Oct 2002 12:31:49 +0530
Subject: [Fsf-friends] Fwd: Free software movement in Cochin University of Science and Technology
Message-ID: <86r8f2speq.fsf@home.this-is-not-a-domain.in>
X-From-Line: getbharatchandran@yahoo.com Thu Oct 03 18:29:23 2002
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Date: Thu, 3 Oct 2002 05:52:51 -0700 (PDT)
From: bharat chandran
Subject: Free software movement in Cochin University of Science and Technology
To: gnu@gnu.org.in
Status: RO
Lines: 42
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MIME-Version: 1.0
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Sir,
An Open Forum of Free Software Movement was held in
the Dept of Polymer Science,Cochin University of
Science and Technology,Cochin,Kerala,India on 25th
September at 2 P.M. for promoting Free Software
Movement in CUSAT.The following decisions were taken
(i) To form a core group of people interested in Free
Software
(ii) To form an egroup for Free Software Movement in
CUSAT. ('FSCUSAT'(CUSAT Free Software Movement >
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/fscusat/) is now
available)
(iii) To start loading Linux in the systems of
interested users
(iv) To arrange a workshop on Free Software towards
the end of October.(For atleast two representatives
from each Department)
(v) A committee was formed with two convernors
1. Mr. G.Santhosh Kumar (Lect. ,Dept of Computer
Science)
2. Mr. Bharat Chandran.R.S (Student, Dept of
Instrumentation)
Regards,
Bharat Chandran
NB:- Please tell me how to be a member of FSF
india.Also tell me how our members in Cochin
University will be able to a member in FSF India
__________________________________________________
Do you Yahoo!?
New DSL Internet Access from SBC & Yahoo!
http://sbc.yahoo.com
From sureshtitus@yahoo.com Mon Oct 7 12:03:35 2002
From: sureshtitus@yahoo.com (=?iso-8859-1?q?Suresh=20Titus?=)
Date: Mon, 7 Oct 2002 13:03:35 +0100 (BST)
Subject: [Fsf-friends] Re: Good News!
Message-ID: <20021007120335.54113.qmail@web40402.mail.yahoo.com>
Thats really good news.
Suresh
________________________________________________________________________
Missed your favourite TV serial last night? Try the new, Yahoo! TV.
visit http://in.tv.yahoo.com
From paivakil@vsnl.net Mon Oct 7 17:22:29 2002
From: paivakil@vsnl.net (Mahesh T Pai)
Date: Mon, 07 Oct 2002 22:52:29 +0530
Subject: [Fsf-friends] Fwd: Free software movement in Cochin University
of Science and Technology
References: <86r8f2speq.fsf@home.this-is-not-a-domain.in>
Message-ID: <3DA1C2D5.7060703@vsnl.net>
Khuzaima A. Lakdawala wrote:
> An Open Forum of Free Software Movement was held in the Dept of
> Polymer Science,Cochin University of Science and
> Technology,Cochin,Kerala,India on 25th
Great news. I am an alumnus of CUSAT, and used to teach the evening
LL.B. students.
> (i) To form a core group of people interested in Free Software
Make sure that there are people from the dept fo computer Sc. and of
course, B. Tech UG students.
> (ii) To form an egroup for Free Software Movement in
Make sure that you do not end up as a 'virtual group'. There are
enough people (users) fed up with vulnerablities of proprietary s/w,
at least in the school of legal studies. Only, you have to train them
to use GNU/Linux systems.
I got my first lesson in 'vendor dependence' from here. In 1996, the
Sch. fo Legl. Studies had started giving 'training' to staff and
students @ Rs. 25/- for two weeks' training to four persons on a
single system. When I went back there, this time as a teacher, I
found that there was network, with all its allied vulnerablities. The
users were quite fed up with frequent virul attacks and
re-installations. But, no one was interested in having a GNU / Linux
installation coz. they were not comfortable with the interface.
> (iii) To start loading Linux in the systems of interested users
Incidentally, I have observed that a large number of systems ( in
several depts. ) run unauthorised copies.
From Kanti Jadia"
I have come in contact with few people who would like to donate
money for this cause.
Now the problem is two fold.
a.To whom should i direct this small amount of money.
b.How can i further the cause so as to help them donate more.They
have been using various free software's for some work and like the
concept too.
On the point of running informal Free Software User Groups.
The group we need to form in nagpur will cater both as a FLUG as
well as a GLUG.
This in simple terms means that they will also provide help in
formalising/configuring/using free software for certain needs.
The monetory portion thus collected will be further directed
towards
promoting use of free software.
We also plan to distribute free software cd's since they are not
available locally.
To support all these activities what things have to be done.
From the following link
http://plug.org.in/minutes.php
i understand that a trust can be formed which will take care of
the activities.
Would like input from all patrons of FSF-India as well as the
members.
regards
Kanti Jadia
From klak@giasbm01.vsnl.net.in Tue Oct 8 06:27:17 2002
From: klak@giasbm01.vsnl.net.in (Khuzaima A. Lakdawala)
Date: 08 Oct 2002 11:57:17 +0530
Subject: [Fsf-friends] RE:FLAG
In-Reply-To: <20021007180102.18767.qmail@webmail9.rediffmail.com>
References: <20021007180102.18767.qmail@webmail9.rediffmail.com>
Message-ID: <861y71cunu.fsf@home.this-is-not-a-domain.in>
Hi Kanti,
On 7 Oct 2002 18:01:02 -0000, "Kanti Jadia" wrote:
> I have come in contact with few people who would like to donate money
> for this cause.
> Now the problem is two fold.
>
> a.To whom should i direct this small amount of money.
This question has been taken up in the FSF India Working Group. Hope
to get an answer shortly.
> On the point of running informal Free Software User Groups.
> The group we need to form in nagpur will cater both as a FLUG as well
> as a GLUG.
> This in simple terms means that they will also provide help in
> formalising/configuring/using free software for certain needs.
> The monetory portion thus collected will be further directed towards
> promoting use of free software.
> We also plan to distribute free software cd's since they are not
> available locally.
>
> To support all these activities what things have to be done.
>
> From the following link
>
> http://plug.org.in/minutes.php
>
> i understand that a trust can be formed which will take care of the
> activities.
FSF India is already such an entity -- although technically it is not
a "trust" but a non-profit company under section 25 of the Companies
Act. You can undertake all of the activities you have described above
under the aegis of FSF India. There is no need to spawn another such
entity at the local level. If you agree with the principles and goals
of FSF India, just join in!
Kanti, I hope you are aware of the complexities involved in floating
and maintaining a legal entity. It will take up time in administrative
activities etc. which could otherwise be devoted to spreading free
software!
The founders of FSF India have already done the ground-work for
us. Why re-invent the wheel? You can straight-away start your
activities under FSF India instead of worrying about forming new
trusts etc.
Regards,
Khuzaima
From nagarjun@hbcse.tifr.res.in Tue Oct 8 14:26:07 2002
From: nagarjun@hbcse.tifr.res.in (Nagarjuna G.)
Date: Tue, 8 Oct 2002 19:56:07 +0530
Subject: [Fsf-friends] Free TTF Fonts of Akruti
Message-ID: <20021008142606.GA23361@hbcse.tifr.res.in>
----- Forwarded message from "M.S.Sridhar" -----
Envelope-to: nagarjun@hbcse.tifr.res.in
Cc: nagarjun@hbcse.tifr.res.in
From: "M.S.Sridhar"
Subject: Fonts
To: jitendras@vsnl.com
X-AntiVirus: OK! AntiVir MailGate Version 2.0.0.0
at hbcse has not found any known virus in this email.
Dear Jitendra and Nagarjun
I have uploaded the fonts at the following url.
www.akruti.com/freedom/fonts/freefont.zip
These can be put on your servers.
I will also publish the glyph list and other details.
Please let me know if there is any problem.
Regards
Sridhar
----- End forwarded message -----
--
------------------------------------------------------------------------
nagarjun@hbcse.tifr.res.in www.hbcse.tifr.res.in/gn/
Key fingerprint = C1E2 1B8C 8E98 A697 68B7 ADAC E956 6D4B DE90 BF01
From fred@bytesforall.org Tue Oct 8 09:49:53 2002
From: fred@bytesforall.org (Frederick Noronha)
Date: Tue, 8 Oct 2002 15:19:53 +0530 (IST)
Subject: [Fsf-friends] SMALL GRANTS: Need resources to write Free Software?
Message-ID:
Sarai/CSDS, a Delhi-based research network that realises the potential of
Free/Open Source software, is offering a limited number of small grants (in
three categories of under Rs 10,000; Rs 10-30,000; and Rs 30,000-60,000) for
those willing to write socially-useful programmes and put these out in the
public domain.
Ownership of these programs will remain with its writer(s), under the
GNU/GLP or similar suitable licence. But the coders will undertake to widely
distribute and make available their work to those who desire to use the
same, in the interest of promoting Free Software/Open Source in India.
Email in your plans and suggestions via email to application@sarai.net with
a copy to fred@bytesforall.org not later than October 31, 2002. Use "FLOSS
application" as the subjectline. This should contain the following details:
* Outline of project
* How this project would be relevant to society's needs
* Stage of the project (if work is underway)
* Time-frame required for completion
* Whether work will be done singly, or if jointly, names of
all individuals/groups to be involved
* Estimated number of man-hours for completion of this project
* Estimated cost with break-up
* Any other information you feel relevant.
Last date for application is October 31, 2002.
Feel free to pass around this note, particularly to students who could
use such help productively.
From getbharatchandran@yahoo.com Thu Oct 3 12:52:51 2002
From: getbharatchandran@yahoo.com (bharat chandran)
Date: Thu, 3 Oct 2002 05:52:51 -0700 (PDT)
Subject: [Fsf-friends] Free software movement in Cochin University of Science and Technology
Message-ID: <20021003125251.49910.qmail@web20205.mail.yahoo.com>
Sir,
An Open Forum of Free Software Movement was held in
the Dept of Polymer Science,Cochin University of
Science and Technology,Cochin,Kerala,India on 25th
September at 2 P.M. for promoting Free Software
Movement in CUSAT.The following decisions were taken
(i) To form a core group of people interested in Free
Software
(ii) To form an egroup for Free Software Movement in
CUSAT. ('FSCUSAT'(CUSAT Free Software Movement >
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/fscusat/) is now
available)
(iii) To start loading Linux in the systems of
interested users
(iv) To arrange a workshop on Free Software towards
the end of October.(For atleast two representatives
from each Department)
(v) A committee was formed with two convernors
1. Mr. G.Santhosh Kumar (Lect. ,Dept of Computer
Science)
2. Mr. Bharat Chandran.R.S (Student, Dept of
Instrumentation)
Regards,
Bharat Chandran
NB:- Please tell me how to be a member of FSF
india.Also tell me how our members in Cochin
University will be able to a member in FSF India
__________________________________________________
Do you Yahoo!?
New DSL Internet Access from SBC & Yahoo!
http://sbc.yahoo.com
From paivakil@yahoo.co.in Mon Oct 7 12:46:51 2002
From: paivakil@yahoo.co.in (Mahesh T Pai)
Date: Mon, 07 Oct 2002 18:16:51 +0530
Subject: [Fsf-friends] Fw: [seul-edu] educationaLinux 2003 miniconference: Call for Papers
Message-ID: <3DA1823B.7010407@yahoo.co.in>
Forwarding:-
===========+++++++++++================
Please forward this release to any educational lists you're on that
have a computer focus, and any computer lists you're on that have an
educational focus. And anyone who wants a learning holiday in sunny
Perth, Western Australia during the Northern Hemisphere's winter. (-:
THE CONFERENCE
educationaLinux 2003, the Education mini-conference attached to the
Australian Linux Conference 2003, is now seeking papers and presenters
for two days of intense learning and networking in the leadup to the
LCA2003 proper.
LCA2003 promises to be a doorbuster conference, a hard act to follow
(which is why we're running before it) and we've obtained permission
to piggyback an Education mini-conference on it - in parallel with a
Debian mini-conference - in the two days leading up to it.
Rolling through into the main conference gives educators involved with
Linux that little bit of extra time with an educational focus, an
extra reason for attending LCA2003. An educational prefix to the main
conference turns up fresh material to hammer out in the workshops.
THE PAPERS
Even before this CFP went out, we've had some interesting papers waved
at us. The presentations will include reports from Australian
implementors fresh from a new rollout in the field.
We're looking to cover two main areas: Linux as seen from an
educational perspective (Monday 27 January), and education as seen
from a Linux perspective (Tuesday 28 January), with some overlap.
The former means presentations on opportunities, problems and
experiences with Linux from the educator's seat, be it school IT
staff, teachers or consultants. We're looking for educational
applications for Linux and what needs to be done to make them better,
features to build on and misfeatures to repair, both theory and testimony.
The latter means presentations on setting up and altering Linux to
meet the special needs of academia, such as the ability to migrate
user contexts between grades, ways of tuning for or dissipating load
spikes from start-of-lesson stampedes, plans and experience with
various network arrangements, adaptations for special-needs input
devices, unobtrusive security hardening; go wild with your special
project or experience!
THE LOCATION
The LCA2003 conference is being competently kitted out for an
optimised, immersive networking experience; just the right balance
between the convenience of everything-laid-on and the interest and
satisfaction of roll-your-own. By penguinistas, for penguinistas.
The University of Western Australia is about the closest thing Oz has
to real historical buildings; these ancient, hallowed halls are
equipped with wireless LAN, wired sound and other modern facilities to
make your visit a highly productive one. Accomodation is close to
hand, the city centre only a few kilometers further away and `geek'
attractions like the UCC, home of one of the first Coke machines on
the Internet and many other digital treasures,
are right on campus.
Perth itself has a wonderfully mild climate, is big enough to offer
practically any facility, and small enough to still be friendly.
Western Australia is packed with interesting things to see (from
unique natural grandeur through impressive industry to world-class
fishing and world-famous wineries) so an extended holiday stay is a
definite option.
The main Conference ends on Australia Day. On the Sunday night you'll
get to see some of the biggest, most impressive fireworks ever to be
launched in Australia.
WHAT YOU NEED TO DO NOW
1. Register for LCA2003, even if you have no paper to present.
2. Notify educationaLinux that you're planning to attend.
3. If you have a paper, submit a precis and a brief bio to
educationaLinux.
4. Arrange your schedule and finances so you can roll up on the day.
THE LINKS
http://plug.linux.org.au/~leonb/lca2003/papers.html Presenters'
instructions
http://plug.linux.org.au/~leonb/lca2003/ educationaLinux home
http://linux.conf.au/ LCA2003 entry
http://conf.linux.org.au/register.html Conference
registrations
http://members.xoom.virgilio.it/mmmgroup/e-gall.html The Spanish
Linkquisition
From srikanthns@vsnl.com Wed Oct 9 10:16:23 2002
From: srikanthns@vsnl.com (N S Srikanth)
Date: Wed, 9 Oct 2002 15:46:23 +0530
Subject: [Fsf-friends] Good news for Linux(GNU Linux?)! On Economic Times today!
Message-ID: <20021009154623.320d991d.srikanthns@vsnl.com>
Hi Listers
Good news for Linux Lovers!
Front Page cover story on Economic Times today (09/10/2002)!
"Linux turns government's "Platform of choice""
It gives details about the IT ministry's broad guide lines and directives
to promote Linux in Govt depts and more so in Engineering colleges.
Isn't this good?
Pl give your feedback.
N S Srikanth
Trivandrum
From klak@giasbm01.vsnl.net.in Wed Oct 9 12:08:05 2002
From: klak@giasbm01.vsnl.net.in (Khuzaima A. Lakdawala)
Date: 09 Oct 2002 17:38:05 +0530
Subject: [Fsf-friends] Profits from piracy
Message-ID: <86vg4b95ne.fsf@home.this-is-not-a-domain.in>
What we were really worried about is beginning to happen:
http://www.salon.com/tech/feature/2002/09/26/piracy_unlimited/
Going "soft" on so-called piracy is now a part of MS's strategy, at
least in China. (India next?)
They have realised that "allowing" piracy to happen is an efficient
way to fight free software. (Not to mention giving away free
(zero-cost) licenses to entire school systems across states and
countries)
Forgive me for this "I told you so" attitude, but please see
http://forum.gnu.org.in/1016695648/index_html
where this strategy was predicted to stress why Cost should not be an
Issue in the advocacy of free software.
--
Khuzaima A. Lakdawala
From klak@giasbm01.vsnl.net.in Wed Oct 9 12:30:33 2002
From: klak@giasbm01.vsnl.net.in (Khuzaima A. Lakdawala)
Date: 09 Oct 2002 18:00:33 +0530
Subject: [Fsf-friends] Re: [FSF-WG] [rajnibakshi@yahoo.com: Re: From Rajni Bakshi]
In-Reply-To:
References:
Message-ID: <86fzvf94ly.fsf@home.this-is-not-a-domain.in>
On Mon, 07 Oct 2002 18:43:14 -0400, Richard Stallman wrote:
> Please tell him about the ways that Indian governments are
> promoting Windows.
>
> From: rajni bakshi
> Subject: Re: From Rajni Bakshi
> To: rms@gnu.org
> Date: Sun, 6 Oct 2002 21:17:04 -0700 (PDT)
>
> Please send me more information about government's
> forcing Windows on schools etc. Especially names and
> contact numbers of people in India who are involved in
> these issues.
> It is not certain if I can write about this myself but
> I will try and alter journalists who would write about
> it.
> Regards,
> Rajni
From paivakil@vsnl.net Wed Oct 9 12:41:16 2002
From: paivakil@vsnl.net (Mahesh T Pai)
Date: Wed, 09 Oct 2002 18:11:16 +0530
Subject: [Fsf-friends] SMALL GRANTS: Need resources to write Free Software?
References:
Message-ID: <3DA423EC.5020405@vsnl.net>
Well, "public domain" is the anti-thesis of GPL. It is certainly not
"free" as the term is used in the GPL. The appropriate translation in
most languages for "free" as used in the GPL is "swatantra". As we
all know, "swatantrata" does not come "sowjanya".
I feel that the people making the grants have to decide (they have
the right to dictate) and, preferably, insist, that the s/w should be
released under the GPL. Otherwise, the grants are likely to be
appropriated towards non-free uses later on.
Please clarify.
Frederick Noronha wrote:
> Sarai/CSDS, a Delhi-based research network that realises the
potential of
> Free/Open Source software, is offering a limited number of small
grants (in
> three categories of under Rs 10,000; Rs 10-30,000; and Rs
30,000-60,000) for
> those willing to write socially-useful programmes and put these out
in the
> public domain.
>
> Ownership of these programs will remain with its writer(s), under the
> GNU/GLP or similar suitable licence. But the coders will undertake
to widely
> distribute and make available their work to those who desire to
use the
> same, in the interest of promoting Free Software/Open Source in India.
If the intention is ensuring public benefit in the long term, it has
to be the GPL. OSD compliance, and OSI certified licenses are, well,
compromises. Guess that I can say that with some authority, for I
have been watching the Free Vs. OSD debate for some time now. Whether
it is the GPL or mere OSD compliance or both, make it clear in the
terms of grant, otherwise, there would be problems in the future.
Regards,
Mahesh T Pai.null
nullnull
From paivakil@vsnl.net Tue Oct 8 18:58:59 2002
From: paivakil@vsnl.net (Mahesh T Pai)
Date: Wed, 09 Oct 2002 00:28:59 +0530
Subject: [Fsf-friends] RE:FLAG
References: <20021007180102.18767.qmail@webmail9.rediffmail.com> <861y71cunu.fsf@home.this-is-not-a-domain.in>
Message-ID: <3DA32AF3.6050108@vsnl.net>
Khuzaima A. Lakdawala wrote:
> FSF India is already such an entity -- although technically it is not
> a "trust" but a non-profit company under section 25 of the Companies
> Act.
And I may add that this puts the FSF-I in a better position vis-a-vis
other forms of incorporation, either as trust or otherwise.
Regards,
Mahesh T Pai.
null
From fred@bytesforall.org Wed Oct 9 22:51:26 2002
From: fred@bytesforall.org (Frederick Noronha)
Date: Thu, 10 Oct 2002 04:21:26 +0530 (IST)
Subject: [Fsf-friends] SMALL GRANTS: Need resources to write Free Software?
In-Reply-To: <3DA423EC.5020405@vsnl.net>
Message-ID:
That's right. You have a point there, Mahesh. I'll pass it on to Sarai,
who have so far been very flexible and understanding on this issue. The
goal is to get more GPLd programmes that can add to the Free Software
domain for the good of everybody.
Which license would FSF members be satisfied with? Which version would you
see as best? Your suggestions are more than welcome.... The intention
would be to keep the software as Free as possible. FN
On Wed, 9 Oct 2002, Mahesh T Pai wrote:
> Well, "public domain" is the anti-thesis of GPL. It is certainly not
> "free" as the term is used in the GPL. The appropriate translation in
> most languages for "free" as used in the GPL is "swatantra". As we
> all know, "swatantrata" does not come "sowjanya".
>
> I feel that the people making the grants have to decide (they have
> the right to dictate) and, preferably, insist, that the s/w should be
> released under the GPL. Otherwise, the grants are likely to be
> appropriated towards non-free uses later on.
>
> Please clarify.
>
> Frederick Noronha wrote:
>
> > Sarai/CSDS, a Delhi-based research network that realises the
> potential of
> > Free/Open Source software, is offering a limited number of small
> grants (in
> > three categories of under Rs 10,000; Rs 10-30,000; and Rs
> 30,000-60,000) for
> > those willing to write socially-useful programmes and put these out
> in the
> > public domain.
> >
> > Ownership of these programs will remain with its writer(s), under the
> > GNU/GLP or similar suitable licence. But the coders will undertake
> to widely
> > distribute and make available their work to those who desire to
> use the
> > same, in the interest of promoting Free Software/Open Source in India.
>
>
> If the intention is ensuring public benefit in the long term, it has
> to be the GPL. OSD compliance, and OSI certified licenses are, well,
> compromises. Guess that I can say that with some authority, for I
> have been watching the Free Vs. OSD debate for some time now. Whether
> it is the GPL or mere OSD compliance or both, make it clear in the
> terms of grant, otherwise, there would be problems in the future.
>
> Regards,
> Mahesh T Pai.null
>
> nullnull
>
>
From fred@bytesforall.org Wed Oct 9 22:07:30 2002
From: fred@bytesforall.org (Frederick Noronha)
Date: Thu, 10 Oct 2002 03:37:30 +0530 (IST)
Subject: [Fsf-friends] ]Open IT - Govt to rewrite source code in Linux
Message-ID:
Inspite of all one's enthusiasm about Free Software and Open Source, it's
hard to be too sure or optimistic about the story below.
If government decides on such policies (i) shouldn't the policy decision
be taken openly, on the record and without the possibility of any later
hanky-panky? (ii) is nobody willing to take responsibility for such a
stand -- which is very welcome -- and say so publicly? (iii) if not, why
should we not conclude that this is just some kind of kite-flying, which
actually may be intended to pressurise some 'proprietory solutions'
vendors to come up for equally behind-closed-doors negotiations?
In a neighbouring country, Pakistan, some quaters at least were trying to
use the GNU/Linux-is-great argument to get Microsoft to reduce its prices.
[One recalls times when a number of attempts were made to appeal to
Microsoft to offer discounts for the use of their products in
schools. These appeals were studiously ignored, or snubbed. Today, when
there is a growing demand for GNU/Linux being implemented in schools
(inspite of blocks like a Microsoft-products-only syllabus in parts of
India), the proprietory coders are willing to offer 'special discounts'.]
It might be a good thing if companies like Microsoft could be convinced to
offer more realistic prices to the Third World (just as, say, book
publishers have special prices for South Asia, which are one-seventh or
less of the Western prices) to take care of the lower earning capacity and
the unfair exchange rate we get for our currencies.=20
But it would be surely a better thing to ask fundamental questions about
what should be the nature of software, whether knowledge should be meant
primarily to harvest profits or to meet desperate human needs. Free
Software and/or Open Source needs to be adopted not just as a cheaper
option, or a matter of convenience, but as a rational choice that would --
in some small way -- make ours a less iniquiteous world by taking the=20
gift of skills and knowledge to those who need it so badly. -FN
PS: To put things very bluntly, is this report a plant? If not, then let's
see that scrap of paper which would make it something more than loud
thinking.....
On Wed, 9 Oct 2002, Ashish Kotamkar wrote:
> Open IT - Govt to rewrite source code in Linux
> TIMES NEWS NETWORK [ WEDNESDAY, OCTOBER 09, 2002 01:29:29 AM]
> http://economictimes.indiatimes.com/cms.dll/articleshow?artid=3D24598339
>=20
> NEW DELHI: If the Chinese have IT, get it. The Indian government seems to=
be
> taking a leaf out of China's operating system, and is planning a countryw=
ide
> drive to promote the open source operating system, Linux, as the 'platfor=
m
> of choice' instead of 'proprietary' solutions.
>=20
> For proprietory, read Microsoft, which controls over 90% of the desktop
> software market.
>=20
> The Department of Information Technology has already devised a strategy t=
o
> introduce Linux and open source software as a de-facto standard in academ=
ic
> institutions, especially in engineering colleges through course work that
> encourages use of such systems.
>=20
> Research establishments would be advised to use and develop re-distributa=
ble
> toolboxes just as Central government departments and state governments wo=
uld
> be asked to use Linux-based offerings.
>=20
> DIT is in talks with leading industry players like IBM and HCL to get a f=
eel
> of their work in the area and invite proposals for joint projects. "As a
> first step we are persuading all government institutions to offer courses=
on
> Linux and programming for Linux environment. We would also set up Linux
> Resource Centres in academic institutes (with co-funding from government =
and
> industry)," said a senior government official.
>=20
> Though India has made a name for itself selling solutions, software as a
> product is expensive within the country. And the cost will bite once Indi=
a
> starts implementing IPR protection in earnest, as it has committed itself
> to.
>=20
> While redistribution of proprietary software is restricted through a lice=
nce
> agreement, the licensing terms for Linux grants the right to obtain and
> redistribute copies. Many analysts believe that China's growing dominance=
in
> the IT space is fuelled by its low cost open source bias.
>=20
> The Chinese government has consistently promoted its local software based=
on
> Linux, both for cost reasons, and reportedly for 'security' concerns as
> well.
>=20
> The source code for proprietory software is not revealed, and this, it is
> believed, has not found favour with the Chinese, especially in defence an=
d
> security related applications.
>=20
> Microsoft, in what many observers and reports say is an attempt to soften
> the Chinese government's stand, recently committed to investing $750m in
> China in three years to help set up a software college and put its money
> into Chinese education.
>=20
> In comparison, Microsoft has announced investments worth only $75m over a
> three-year time frame in India. Howver, the Chinese company Redflag
> Software, which was set up by the Chinese Academy of Sciences, the countr=
y's
> most prestigious research institute, has often come out with low-cost
> software based on Linux, in direct competition to Windows-based software.
>=20
> The Indian government's plan, however, is not driven by security concerns=
,
> but by the far more simple arithmetic of costing. To put it simply, India
> being a developing country needs low cost solutions.
>=20
> Unlike the Microsoft-developed Windows operating system, Linux code is fr=
ee
> and downloadable from the internet. With the addition of special
> applications, it can be personalized to meet specific needs.
>=20
> An industry-government-user-developer conference on the subject would be
> organised to throw up ideas for specific initiatives including funding,
> reliable sources told ET.
>=20
> The only issue here is support and services, which Indian government sour=
ces
> feel is not likely to be an issue in a country known for its software
> support and service skills.
>=20
> Like China, the government is also eyeing the increasingly lucrative glob=
al
> support and services market for the Linux environment may prove lucrative=
=2E
> While proprietary support agreements govern only the systems purchased (w=
ith
> licences), for free software support is independent of the number of copi=
es
> owned.
>=20
> "With applications in security being a focus area, inputs have been sough=
t
> from the Defence on their experience with Linux. Indian-language based
> solutions, e-governance, embedded and high performance cluster solutions =
are
> other areas. But firstly we want to concretise the position on IPR issues=
in
> the use of Linux," the source said.
>=20
> DIT is planning a three-tier mechanism, with itself as the first, industr=
y,
> user groups and state governments as the second and a national apex
> committee headed either by a government representative, an industry exper=
t
> or an academician to oversee manpower and skill development, applications
> development and deployment and public policy support, said sources.
>=20
> According to IDC's figures for '00, Microsoft still controlled 94% of the
> desktop software market and while Linux is expected to overtake the numbe=
r
> two =97 Apple Mac OS =97 by '03, it would still control less than 4% of t=
he
> market.
>=20
> In server software, it fares a little better and is expected to control
> around 30% of the market by '03, according to IDC. Linux, which has
> established itself in the server space, is an open reliable OS that runs =
on
> virtually any platform and was developd by Finnish technologist Linus
> Torvalds.
>=20
> After developing the initial source code, Linus made it available on the
> Internet for use, feedback and further development.
From fred@bytesforall.org Wed Oct 9 21:24:41 2002
From: fred@bytesforall.org (Frederick Noronha)
Date: Thu, 10 Oct 2002 02:54:41 +0530 (IST)
Subject: [Fsf-friends] INTERVIEW: Europe (and a desi) takes a deeper look at FLOSS
Message-ID:
EUROPE TAKES A DEEPER LOOK AT FREE/LIBRE AND OPEN SOURCE SOFTWARE...
It is being viewed as a "major research project" coming out of Europe, that
takes a detailed look at the reasons behind the growing use of Free and Open
Source software. One of the key persons behind this study is Rishab Aiyer
Ghosh, who moved from the Indian capital of New Delhi to Europe just a
couple of years ago.
Does Aiyer Ghosh see this report changing the way Free and Open Source
software is seen? "Not necessarily," says he modestly. But then adds, almost
as an after-thought: "But hopefully the study will increase the depth and
clarity with which the phenomenon is understood."
Commentators have already called this study perhaps the "first large-scale
rigorous study concerning any aspect of free software". It included
interviewers with thousands of developers and hundreds of businesses.
Till a couple of years back, the 27-year-old Indian-born author of the study
was based in Delhi, and closely involved in the Indian internet/telecom
scene. He wrote for technical and mainstream publications too.
Ghosh had his own newsletter, 'Indian Techonomist', which went out to people
like Reed Hundt and Vint Cerf, and he wrote various consultation papers on
the opening up Internet policy (especially to small providers) on the
request of senior Indian government officials.
Extracts from an exclusive interview Aiyer Ghosh had
with Frederick Noronha :
-----------------------------------------------------------------------
FN: What was your contribution in preparing the report?
-----------------------------------------------------------------------
I wrote the original proposal and workplan for the FLOSS study, and after
approval from the EC (European Commission), was coordinator of the project
consortium (University of Maastricht and Berlecon Research). I was lead
author of the parts written at the university.
-----------------------------------------------------------------------
FN: How much time was put into it in all?
-----------------------------------------------------------------------
FLOSS was a 13 month project. there were three people at the university and
three at Berlecon Research working on it. But I off-hand can't give you a
person-hours breakdown!
-----------------------------------------------------------------------
FN: What was the most surprising finding/s?
-----------------------------------------------------------------------
That's a hard question to answer. We weren't really surprised by our own
findings, but from the user survey (Berlecon; final report part 1) the level
of F/OSS use among organisations was higher than one might have expected
(e.g. 6% of all companies use some F/OSS on the desktop).
An important, though expected, finding was that licence fees were #3 on the
list of reasons for user organisations choosing F/OSS -- stability and
security were more important.
In the developer survey (part 4) one interesting result was that despite the
adoption of the term Open Source among most of the media and support
structure (e.g. O'Reilly, Slashdot, Sourceforge) developers themselves
identify themselves with the term free software by a huge margin.
-----------------------------------------------------------------------
FN: What are the aspects that are still to be researched on FLOSS, in your
view?
-----------------------------------------------------------------------
Much more work needs to be done on measuring organisation and production of
the software itself (started in part 5 of the report); lots of analysis
remains to be done on the data from the developer survey.
On the user side, due to a limited budget, FLOSS didn't ask organisations
who said they don't use any F/OSS why they don't do so, which would have
been interesting.
-----------------------------------------------------------------------
FN: This dilemma of explaianing why affluent Europe is increasing turning to
FLOSS, how would you look at it?
-----------------------------------------------------------------------
I don't see that as a dilemma.
I can imagine that licence fee savings are an attraction in developing
countries, but arguably the total cost of ownership isn't necessarily much
lower for f/oss than for proprietary solutions.
Certainly, most advocacy in Europe emphasises other advantages rather than
cost, which is a dubious advantage if it is one at all and easier to attack
("cheap" software must be bad...)
As the user survey showed, F/OSS is being adopted more for stability and
security than price.
-----------------------------------------------------------------------
FN: Besides this study, what have you been busy with since moving out of
India?
-----------------------------------------------------------------------
i moved to Maastricht in October 2000, and the FLOSS proposal was submitted
that month. I've been working mostly full-time with this study and related
research, and speak frequently on the topic of free software and the
"cooking-pot market" model I developed to explain non-monetary economic
activity on the Internet. (Ghosh explains the 'cooking pot model' at
http://www.firstmonday.org/issues/issue3_3/ghosh/ )
I also continue my involvement as a founding editor of First Monday, the now
very successful peer-reviewed Internet journal, and organised the first
First Monday conference in Maastricht last year
(www.infonomics.nl/newdefinitions/)
-----------------------------------------------------------------------
FN: Do you see this report as changing the way FLOSS is seen?
-----------------------------------------------------------------------
Not necessarily. But hopefully the study will increase the depth and clarity
with which the phenomenon is understood.
-----------------------------------------------------------------------
FN: Could you tell us something about how you chose the word -- rather apt
in my view -- FLOSS, to describe both Free Software and Open Source in one
neat twist of phrase?
-----------------------------------------------------------------------
European Commission projects often have long-winded titles and the official
project acronym is therefore quite important.
Early drafts of the project proposal were entitled Free/Open Source User and
Developer Study. FOSUDS sounded rather less catchy than FLOSS, which also
had the additional advantage of incorporating "Libre Software", a term that
is hardly in use outside the french-speaking members of the EC bureaucracy,
which is a pity.
-----------------------------------------------------------------------
FN: If you had a chance to do this study all over again, what would you have
done differently?
-----------------------------------------------------------------------
I don't know, really, still digesting what we've just finished. But
certainly we would have asked user organisations for reasons _not_ to use
F/OSS...
See the report at
http://www.infonomics.nl/FLOSS/report/
For a photo of Aiyer Ghosh, please see
http://www.infonomics.nl/niew/about/people_cv.php?id=81
From akr@linux-delhi.org Thu Oct 10 05:13:38 2002
From: akr@linux-delhi.org (akr!linux-delhi.org@linux-delhi.org)
Date: Thu, 10 Oct 2002 01:13:38 -0400
Subject: [Fsf-friends] need a summary comparison of MS vs linux
Message-ID: <29950-220021041051338983@M2W049.mail2web.com>
i need a quick and short summary comparison of MS versus Linux (or open
source) deployment=2E i know that there could be several (google searchabl=
e)
sites that i can troll=2E but if any of you have a ready document, or can
point to the right website or url, i would be very grateful=2E basically t=
he
document should describe in short and non-technical language, the
cost-benefit analysis, the non-monetary benefits, and long term vs short
term implications of using open source/free software, as against
proprietary software like MS=2E
thanks in advance,
ajit ranade=2E
--------------------------------------------------------------------
mail2web - Check your email from the web at
http://mail2web=2Ecom/ =2E
From paivakil@vsnl.net Thu Oct 10 13:58:36 2002
From: paivakil@vsnl.net (Mahesh T Pai)
Date: Thu, 10 Oct 2002 19:28:36 +0530
Subject: [Fsf-friends] SMALL GRANTS: Need resources to write Free Software?
References:
Message-ID: <3DA5878C.6090102@vsnl.net>
Frederick Noronha wrote:
> Which version would you see as best?
Using older _versions_ of a license can create problems. New versions
are created to plug loop holes, or to avoid problems which were not
foreseen with earlier versions. Moreover, it is common for most
'swatantra' licenses to permit users / licencees to adopt later versions*.
> ... The intention would be to keep the software as Free as
> possible.
Then, my vote is for GPL.
Most of OSI certified licenses do measure up to the GPL in terms of
'swatantrata' element in so far as modifications and redistribution is
concerned. But, they do not preserve the 'greater public good' part
of the GPL. At least some OSI approved licenses do not preserve the
right of access to modifications made by third parties. This can
result in loss of freedom. The BSD and MIT licenses are two best
examples. Such licenses actually result in loss of 'swatantrata'
aspect of the GPL - the best example is kerberos (I am not sure of the
spelling)
For the purpose of the grant, you can consider a statement something
like this:-
1. The contributions should be licensed under the GNU/GPL.
2. Copyright in the contributions will vest in the author.
3. SARAI will consider use of other OSI approved licenses, if the
grantee/s is/are able to point out special and compelling reasons for
using a different license.
Regards,
Mahesh T Pai.
* digression:- is it not better that we Indians use 'swatantra'to mean
'free as in freedom'? We need to adopt a term to be uniformly used in
Indian languages for 'free as in beer'. Malayalam has 'soujanyam'.
Any suggestions from other languages? This rather important, for
ultimately, we will need to translate the GPL into Indian languages,
for better understanding amongst the public, if for nothing else. It
is not better that *if possible*, we use uniform terminology in all
Indian Languages?
From fred@bytesforall.org Fri Oct 11 09:50:47 2002
From: fred@bytesforall.org (Frederick Noronha)
Date: Fri, 11 Oct 2002 15:20:47 +0530 (IST)
Subject: [Fsf-friends] SMALL GRANTS: Need resources to write Free Software?
In-Reply-To: <3DA5878C.6090102@vsnl.net>
Message-ID:
Jeebesh, I think Mahesh has put in a very interesting argument. Since our
goal is not to control the product, but to ensure that it is used as
widely as possible for wider societal good, perhaps there should be no
problem in accepting the same?
Wonder if our friends at FSF-India have any further suggestions for us? We
would like the intentions of this experiment to be transparent. FN
On Thu, 10 Oct 2002, Mahesh T Pai wrote:
> Frederick Noronha wrote:
>
> > Which version would you see as best?
>
> Using older _versions_ of a license can create problems. New versions
> are created to plug loop holes, or to avoid problems which were not
> foreseen with earlier versions. Moreover, it is common for most
> 'swatantra' licenses to permit users / licencees to adopt later versions*.
>
> > ... The intention would be to keep the software as Free as
> > possible.
>
> Then, my vote is for GPL.
>
> Most of OSI certified licenses do measure up to the GPL in terms of
> 'swatantrata' element in so far as modifications and redistribution is
> concerned. But, they do not preserve the 'greater public good' part
> of the GPL. At least some OSI approved licenses do not preserve the
> right of access to modifications made by third parties. This can
> result in loss of freedom. The BSD and MIT licenses are two best
> examples. Such licenses actually result in loss of 'swatantrata'
> aspect of the GPL - the best example is kerberos (I am not sure of the
> spelling)
>
> For the purpose of the grant, you can consider a statement something
> like this:-
> 1. The contributions should be licensed under the GNU/GPL.
> 2. Copyright in the contributions will vest in the author.
> 3. SARAI will consider use of other OSI approved licenses, if the
> grantee/s is/are able to point out special and compelling reasons for
> using a different license.
>
> Regards,
> Mahesh T Pai.
>
>
> * digression:- is it not better that we Indians use 'swatantra'to mean
> 'free as in freedom'? We need to adopt a term to be uniformly used in
> Indian languages for 'free as in beer'. Malayalam has 'soujanyam'.
> Any suggestions from other languages? This rather important, for
> ultimately, we will need to translate the GPL into Indian languages,
> for better understanding amongst the public, if for nothing else. It
> is not better that *if possible*, we use uniform terminology in all
> Indian Languages?
>
>
From arun@gnu.org.in Fri Oct 11 16:16:49 2002
From: arun@gnu.org.in (Arun M)
Date: 11 Oct 2002 21:46:49 +0530
Subject: [Fsf-friends] ]Open IT - Govt to rewrite source code in Linux
In-Reply-To:
References:
Message-ID: <1034353011.436.116.camel@debian-demo>
On Thu, 2002-10-10 at 03:37, Frederick Noronha wrote:
> Inspite of all one's enthusiasm about Free Software and Open Source, it's
> hard to be too sure or optimistic about the story below.
>
> If government decides on such policies (i) shouldn't the policy decision
> be taken openly, on the record and without the possibility of any later
> hanky-panky? (ii) is nobody willing to take responsibility for such a
> stand -- which is very welcome -- and say so publicly? (iii) if not, why
> should we not conclude that this is just some kind of kite-flying, which
> actually may be intended to pressurise some 'proprietory solutions'
> vendors to come up for equally behind-closed-doors negotiations?
I share your view. Following para clearly tells it. We have seen our
"great" representatives begging with CEOs of MNCs.
BTW, IT@School project is going more and more to Free Software.
Hope we will have some good news in few months. Also govt seems to be
going for Open Office.
> Microsoft, in what many observers and reports say is an attempt to
soften
> the Chinese government's stand, recently committed to investing $750m
in
> China in three years to help set up a software college and put its
money
> into Chinese education.
>
> In comparison, Microsoft has announced investments worth only $75m
over a
> three-year time frame in India. Howver, the Chinese company Redflag
> Software, which was set up by the Chinese Academy of Sciences, the
country's
> most prestigious research institute, has often come out with low-cost
> software based on Linux, in direct competition to Windows-based
software.
From arun@freedevelopers.net Sat Oct 12 09:09:10 2002
From: arun@freedevelopers.net (Arun M)
Date: 12 Oct 2002 14:39:10 +0530
Subject: [Fsf-friends] Re: LINK: Open domain software meet
In-Reply-To:
References:
Message-ID: <1034413751.24881.14.camel@debian>
> Open Domain Software Movement has gained momentum in recent years. Open
> software is increasingly viewed as a panacea to the digital divide and a
> means of providing cost effective e-governance.
>
> Many countries are ready to exploit the benefits of Open Source software
> by framing policies encouraging the use of open source
> software wherever possible. Open software are usually copyrighted or
> copylefted. While they are generally freely distributable,
> there are certain redistribution and reusability guidelines that require
> the attention of every user of that software.
I was just wondering, in India, do we really have 'Open Source
Movement', less a 'Open Domain Software Movement'.
What is the role of Open Source Movement !!!
Is it really a Movement or just a 'mask' some people wanted, to further
their commercial interest ?
I think Fred's interview with Rishab Aiyer, gives some idea.
In the developer survey (part 4), one interesting result was, despite
the adoption of the term "open source" among most of the media and
support structure (e.g., O'Reilly, Slashdot, Sourceforge), developers
themselves identify with the term free software by a huge margin.
It tells who dont wants to say Free Software, its not Developer nor the
User.
From unmadindu@Softhome.net Sat Oct 12 13:19:01 2002
From: unmadindu@Softhome.net (Sayamindu Dasgupta)
Date: 12 Oct 2002 18:49:01 +0530
Subject: [Fsf-friends] not using sourceforge
Message-ID: <1034428750.854.15.camel@localhost.localdomain>
Hello,
I want to start a Free project of my own (a centralised place for
Unicode compliant Bangla fonts) , and I do not want to use sourceforge.
I was looking for alternatives
The first one that cam to my mind was savannah.gnu.org
But, for some reason, they have not responded to my Project proposal (it
is almost 1.5 weeks now)
So, I was thinking of some other place - https://developer.berlios.de/
Can anyone advice me on this site - do they have licensing terms similar
to srcfrge??
-iti-
sayamindu
From ckra@vsnl.net Mon Oct 14 05:31:40 2002
From: ckra@vsnl.net (CK Raju)
Date: Mon, 14 Oct 2002 11:01:40 +0530
Subject: [Fsf-friends] The Hindu takes up the thread
Message-ID:
The Hindu has taken up the thread in case of Pattenchery Grama Panchayat,
being forced to opt Windows OS, even after getting a resolution passed to
adopt Free software.
The link is at
http://www.hinduonnet.com/stories/2002101404040400.htm
Cheers to Roy Mathew who brought it out.
CK Raju
From arun@gnu.org.in Mon Oct 14 09:44:37 2002
From: arun@gnu.org.in (Arun M)
Date: 14 Oct 2002 15:14:37 +0530
Subject: [Fsf-friends] IRC Channel.
Message-ID: <1034588680.437.2.camel@debian-demo>
Hi friends,
A channel is registered in irc.openprojects.net/irc.debian.org.
channel name is #fsf-india. See you there.
regards
Arun.
From arun@freedevelopers.net Mon Oct 14 10:09:03 2002
From: arun@freedevelopers.net (Arun M)
Date: 14 Oct 2002 15:39:03 +0530
Subject: [Fsf-friends] The Hindu takes up the thread
In-Reply-To:
References:
Message-ID: <1034590144.437.25.camel@debian-demo>
On Mon, 2002-10-14 at 11:01, CK Raju wrote:
> The Hindu has taken up the thread in case of Pattenchery Grama Panchayat,
> being forced to opt Windows OS, even after getting a resolution passed to
> adopt Free software.
This is a very good news.
Regarding the C-DIT/Friends issue, its basically not a Free Software vs
Proprietary. Its about who is having copyright of the software. The
issue wont get solved with the use of Free Software.
Even if the work is going to be release as Free Software CDIT/Govt will
have to make sure proper agreements regarding the licensing are done.
It would be nice to know C-DIT's stand on licensing of new version of
'Friends'.
Any way its a very good news that C-DIT is also moving to Free Software.
Now only IKM is pro-MS. They will soon get isolated if they didnt change
stand.
Regards,
Arun.
From paivakil@vsnl.net Mon Oct 14 10:49:27 2002
From: paivakil@vsnl.net (Mahesh T Pai)
Date: Mon, 14 Oct 2002 16:19:27 +0530
Subject: [Fsf-friends] The Hindu takes up the thread
References: <1034590144.437.25.camel@debian-demo>
Message-ID: <3DAAA137.1000803@vsnl.net>
Arun M wrote:
> Regarding the C-DIT/Friends issue, its basically not a Free Software vs
> Proprietary. Its about who is having copyright of the software. The
> issue wont get solved with the use of Free Software.
I disagree with Arun here.
Free s/w is about *swatantryam* to use, redistribute, change the
sources and fine tune the original program to suit one's own needs.
I understand that C-DIT had a contract for development of s/w for the
FRIENDS project with one company 'a', and once the C-DIT switched
maintenance and future development to company 'b', company 'a'
(naturally) got green eyed, and initiated the litigation. If the s/w
developed by C-DIT was covered by a standard free license, like the
GPL, or at least one of the OSI approved licenses, C-DIT would not
have been in the soup it was in.
That apart, if I employ "X" to develop s/w for me, the s/w developed
by X belongs to me; not X, *unless* there is a separate agreement to
the effect that the s/w will belong to "X". So, I do not get what the
C-DIT noise was about.
> Even if the work is going to be release as Free Software CDIT/Govt will
> have to make sure proper agreements regarding the licensing are done.
"Free software" becomes "free software" when it covered by a license
which ensures *freedom*. This license *is* an agreement; whether it
be the GPL at one end, and BSD at other, and everything in between.
> Any way its a very good news that C-DIT is also moving to Free Software.
They are moving towards 'sowjanyam' not 'swatantryam', note the talks
about *volunteers*. ( I am subject to correction here ).
Regards,
Mahesh T Pai.
From gnu@vsnl.net Mon Oct 14 11:17:09 2002
From: gnu@vsnl.net (Ramakrishnan M)
Date: 14 Oct 2002 07:17:09 -0400
Subject: [Fsf-friends] IRC Channel.
In-Reply-To: <1034588680.437.2.camel@debian-demo>
References: <1034588680.437.2.camel@debian-demo>
Message-ID: <87of9x8e2y.fsf@vsnl.net>
|| On 14 Oct 2002 15:14:37 +0530
|| Arun M wrote:
am> Hi friends,
am> A channel is registered in irc.openprojects.net/irc.debian.org.
am> channel name is #fsf-india. See you there.
But FSF and Debian long back abandaned openprojects and are using Freenode
for various reasons..
--
Ramakrishnan M (http://www.hackGNU.org/)
Use Free Software (http://www.gnu.org/)
From arun@gnu.org.in Mon Oct 14 14:08:03 2002
From: arun@gnu.org.in (Arun M)
Date: 14 Oct 2002 19:38:03 +0530
Subject: [Fsf-friends] IRC Channel.
In-Reply-To: <87of9x8e2y.fsf@vsnl.net>
References: <1034588680.437.2.camel@debian-demo> <87of9x8e2y.fsf@vsnl.net>
Message-ID: <1034604484.459.21.camel@debian-demo>
On Mon, 2002-10-14 at 16:47, Ramakrishnan M wrote:
> || On 14 Oct 2002 15:14:37 +0530
> || Arun M wrote:
>
> am> Hi friends,
> am> A channel is registered in irc.openprojects.net/irc.debian.org.
> am> channel name is #fsf-india. See you there.
>
> But FSF and Debian long back abandaned openprojects and are using Freenode
> for various reasons..
I noticed that the openproject changed the name to freenode.
http://freenode.net/faq.shtml#namechange
irc.freenode.net = irc.openprojects.net = irc.debian.org all works
From arun@freedevelopers.net Mon Oct 14 14:21:38 2002
From: arun@freedevelopers.net (Arun M)
Date: 14 Oct 2002 19:51:38 +0530
Subject: [Fsf-friends] The Hindu takes up the thread
In-Reply-To: <3DAAA137.1000803@vsnl.net>
References:
<1034590144.437.25.camel@debian-demo> <3DAAA137.1000803@vsnl.net>
Message-ID: <1034605300.459.35.camel@debian-demo>
> > Regarding the C-DIT/Friends issue, its basically not a Free Software vs
> > Proprietary. Its about who is having copyright of the software. The
> > issue wont get solved with the use of Free Software.
>
> I disagree with Arun here.
>
> Free s/w is about *swatantryam* to use, redistribute, change the
> sources and fine tune the original program to suit one's own needs.
>
> I understand that C-DIT had a contract for development of s/w for the
> FRIENDS project with one company 'a', and once the C-DIT switched
> maintenance and future development to company 'b', company 'a'
> (naturally) got green eyed, and initiated the litigation. If the s/w
> developed by C-DIT was covered by a standard free license, like the
> GPL, or at least one of the OSI approved licenses, C-DIT would not
> have been in the soup it was in.
Yes, thats the point. What required is not *using* Free Software to
develop a new solution for 'Friends'. But creating the software under
Free Software license agreement. That too with proper agreement.
Proper care must be given in agreements with people working on the
new project(saying they will release code in Free Software License').
If that is not done similar issues will come.
The particular 'Friends' issue can be solved even without Free Software
license(not that i am suggesting that solution).
From psk"
Vinay Pawar wrote :
>I think the idea of free software should sink in
>to peoples minds.
Rightly said pawar. The idea of Free Software should be in the
minds of believers. But as anything else there should be some one
to talk about it.Only because there are a few percentage of the
total community of Developers know what the stuff FsF* is.
The main problem is there is no official topics in the normal
cource of study for any computer student or developer to know
about FsF. A developer can live his entire life without knowing
about FsF and can use FsF products..( Sorry that's the case in
India Now)
Another problem is a developer or student who wants to know
about some GNU stuff have no place to go for
information..(bandwidth problem will block him from living in
internet)
>Forcing it in by a "Activists Group"
>wouldn't help,
Right.... Never force someone to believe in a philosophy.. But the
ideas can be given to the air and let others smell it..
>instead might be counter-productive.
>All that needs to be done is that every LUG in the
>country should have atleast one FSF representative.
It's the way.. The Flags* and the current LUG's are the same
except in two things.
1)Flags will be saying the ethics too
2)Flags will contain other GNU lovers also than GNU/Linux.. (other
OS's such as GNU/Hurd and similar BSD stuff and etal.)
>I might've suggested this before. It works. It has
>worked for us at the Pune GNU/Linux Users Group.
>Noticed on multiple ocassions as the most active
>and coolest User Group in the country.
>Almost all of the "flag" activities could/should be
>done at existing User Groups. It should be understood
>by the LUG's that Linux(yes, i mean the kernel)
>wouldn't have gone very far if it wouldn't be under
>the GPL.
>
>Thanks,
>Vinay Pawar
there should not be any competetion between the existing LUG's and
Flags. It'll be better to convert the LUGS in the Flag way.
Something like start Flags where there are no LUGS and let the
LUGs come in the Flag way (don't bother about the names but the
content)
-HTH
-psk
__________________________________________________________
Give your Company an email address like
ravi @ ravi-exports.com. Sign up for Rediffmail Pro today!
Know more. http://www.rediffmailpro.com/signup/
From psk"
Khuzaima A. Lakdawala wrote :
>No need to formalize it with "rules" etc. You
>will probably get caught up in your own
>mini-bureaucracy :) Isn't FSF India enough of a
>formal organisation to work under? Why add another
>layer of formality with "official rules" etc?
The idea is not about adding a new layer of formality. The
formalization was just saying about the things for the groups to
work in the FsF (Actually both in and out in the Internet). The
FORMAL was the only word that can be used at that place. It was
about the activities of FsF itself. Just acting and working in
local areas which will help the FsF india.
(Something similar to FsF and FsF-India. See India is a wide
country)
>Just do what you want to do in as informal a
>manner as possible. When you do need an
>"official" banner, the banner of FSF India is
>enough. You don't need another one.
Flag is not another one but FsF itself (FsF Local Activists
Groups). It will/should contain all the ideas of FsF and FsF only.
It should not contain anything that hurts freedom.
Why can't it be started as a sub group using a sub-domain in the
FsF India and talk the Freedom locally? See there are problems of
Freedom in each local stations.
How will others consider about a talk of the political matter
which promotes the propritory stuff. (for eg. In Kerala the IT
Kerala mission can use the Freedom stuff to save a lot of money
with the government and in Kollam (a local place in Kerala) the
mayor can talk with the Flag for using GNU for the local use. Hope
s/he can't arrage a meeting with FsF india)
When it comes to some matter which includes outside locality too
let Flags refer FSF-India. Classification is something like
dividing the batch of students in a school into different
batches.
--HTH
--psk
__________________________________________________________
Give your Company an email address like
ravi @ ravi-exports.com. Sign up for Rediffmail Pro today!
Know more. http://www.rediffmailpro.com/signup/
From fred@bytesforall.org Tue Oct 15 18:48:00 2002
From: fred@bytesforall.org (Frederick Noronha)
Date: Wed, 16 Oct 2002 00:18:00 +0530 (IST)
Subject: [Fsf-friends] FLOSS... e-government... and India
Message-ID:
Open Source... e-government ... and India
This is an international conference on Open Source (Free Software/Open
Source might have been a better description) in the US. And look at the
'desi' participation: Rishab Aiyer Ghosh (27) ex-Delhi and key author of
the FLOSS European study; a special session for India (Ajay Kumar
of Kerala, Jivtesh Maini of Punjab, Sunil Abraham of Mahiti-Bangalore...
a convert to GNU/Linux and its relevance for NGOs, and Vinay Deshpande of
Simputer Trust). There are also other desi-sounding names. Wish more desis
could travel the globe at the drop of a hat... there are more points to
be made http://www.egovos.org/egovosagenda.htm
* * * * * * * * *
More such info at http://linuxinindia.pitas.com
* * * * * * * * *
From gnu@vsnl.net Tue Oct 15 12:56:35 2002
From: gnu@vsnl.net (Ramakrishnan M)
Date: 15 Oct 2002 08:56:35 -0400
Subject: [Fsf-friends] The Hindu takes up the thread
In-Reply-To: <1034605300.459.35.camel@debian-demo>
References:
<1034590144.437.25.camel@debian-demo> <3DAAA137.1000803@vsnl.net>
<1034605300.459.35.camel@debian-demo>
Message-ID: <87of9v508s.fsf@vsnl.net>
|| On 14 Oct 2002 19:51:38 +0530
|| Arun M wrote:
am> Yes, thats the point. What required is not *using* Free Software to
am> develop a new solution for 'Friends'. But creating the software under
am> Free Software license agreement. That too with proper agreement.
But as far as I interpret the report, it says they are going to *develop*
free software solution in colaboration with other groups. The word and
concept *free software* directly implies it is bound by a Free License.
--
Ramakrishnan M (http://www.hackGNU.org/)
Use Free Software (http://www.gnu.org/)
From gnu@vsnl.net Tue Oct 15 13:02:16 2002
From: gnu@vsnl.net (Ramakrishnan M)
Date: 15 Oct 2002 09:02:16 -0400
Subject: [Fsf-friends] IRC Channel.
In-Reply-To: <1034604484.459.21.camel@debian-demo>
References: <1034588680.437.2.camel@debian-demo> <87of9x8e2y.fsf@vsnl.net>
<1034604484.459.21.camel@debian-demo>
Message-ID: <87fzv74zzb.fsf@vsnl.net>
|| On 14 Oct 2002 19:38:03 +0530
|| Arun M wrote:
am> irc.freenode.net = irc.openprojects.net = irc.debian.org all works
Whatever it is. The point is that the person who runs OPN (or whatever)
used to spam the channels afew months back. I don't know what happened
to it. Debian Project was considering a different service, I don't
know what happened to it.
Why not install something on our own gnu.org.in? instead of going
somewhere else?
--
Ramakrishnan M (http://www.hackGNU.org/)
Use Free Software (http://www.gnu.org/)
From arun@gnu.org.in Fri Oct 18 16:22:49 2002
From: arun@gnu.org.in (Arun M)
Date: 18 Oct 2002 21:52:49 +0530
Subject: [Fsf-friends] Trip is on again!
Message-ID: <1034958176.527.13.camel@debian-demo>
RMS is coming to India
The trip is on again. I should arrive in Bangalore in the morning on
Oct 31. My plan is to go to Goa on Nov 6 and to Delhi on Nov 8. I
will leave Delhi on Nov 11 in the evening.
From ckra@vsnl.net Sat Oct 19 17:19:12 2002
From: ckra@vsnl.net (CK Raju)
Date: Sat, 19 Oct 2002 22:49:12 +0530
Subject: [Fsf-friends] Re: [Bytesforall_Readers] More on Windows versus Free Software
In-Reply-To:
References:
Message-ID:
Hindu archives it the next day.
Here's the new link
http://www.hinduonnet.com/thehindu/2002/10/15/stories/2002101404040400.htm
CK Raju
On Saturday 19 October 2002 00:01, you wrote:
> Yes, I too had a problem in accessing it. Maybe we could source the journo
> who wrote it, Roy Mathews. Raju could you help? Tks, FN
>
> On Fri, 18 Oct 2002, James Howison wrote:
From baiju@freeshell.org Mon Oct 21 06:02:05 2002
From: baiju@freeshell.org (Baiju M)
Date: Mon, 21 Oct 2002 10:02:05 +0400 (SCT)
Subject: [Fsf-friends] Police put GNU/Linux on trial
Message-ID: <13305.202.88.235.92.1035180125.squirrel@otaku.freeshell.org>
http://news.zdnet.co.uk/story/0,,t269-s2123999,00.html
From nagarjun@hbcse.tifr.res.in Wed Oct 23 05:08:57 2002
From: nagarjun@hbcse.tifr.res.in (Nagarjuna G.)
Date: Wed, 23 Oct 2002 10:38:57 +0530
Subject: [Fsf-friends] FSF-Edu mailing list
Message-ID: <20021023050857.GA19526@hbcse.tifr.res.in>
Due to some problems with the fsf-edu mailing list, the list has been
recreated with the same members. Some of you who have configured the
list may have lost the configurations in this process, such as if you
have set the mailing list in the digest mode.
If you find any problems in accessing please inform me.
Sorry for the inconvenience!
Nagarjuna
From unmadindu@Softhome.net Wed Oct 23 15:25:54 2002
From: unmadindu@Softhome.net (Sayamindu Dasgupta)
Date: 23 Oct 2002 20:55:54 +0530
Subject: [Fsf-friends] US State Congressman tries to ban the GPL
Message-ID: <1035386750.810.17.camel@localhost.localdomain>
Hello,
I just got this at newforge - entire text copy pasted (apologies for
that)
It would be helpful if you can fwd this to your American friends, who in
turn can write to these Congressmen.
-regards-
Sayamindu
PS: Sayan, could you post an article on this at www.peacefualction.org,
I am not being able to access the administrative interface
=========Begin Message================
Wednesday October 23, 2002 - [ 12:47 PM GMT ] Print this Article
Topic - Government
An anonymous reader writes: "Leaders of the New Democrat Coalition
attempt to outlaw GPL. A call to sign off on explicit rejection of
"licenses that would prevent or discourage commercial adoption of
promising cyber security technologies developed through federal R &
D." has been issued by Adam Smith, Congressman for the Ninth
District in the State of Washington.
It's already signed off on by Rep. Tom Davis(R-Va), Chairman of
Government Reform Subcomittee on Technology, and Rep. Jim Turner
(D-TX) Ranking Member of the same committee, with the backing of
Rep. Jim Davis (D-FL), and Rep. Ron Kind (D-WI).
It's a note to fellow New Democrats under the guise of protecting
commercial interest's right to make money from the fruits of federal
R & D, and to sign off on an attached letter to Richard A. Clarke,
Chair of the President's Critical Infrastructure.
They are attempting to convince Clarke, Chair of the President's
that licensing terms such as "those in the GNU or GPL" are
restrictive, preclude innovation, improvement, adoption and
establishment of commercial IP rights.
Let's take a look at the highlights:
1) They use the Internet, by virtue of TCP/IP, as "proof" of their
thesis.
2) They state that you cannot improve OR adopt OR commercialize GPL
software.
3) They state that you cannot integrate GPL'd software with
proprietery software.
4) They say you should keep publicly funded code away from the
public sector, so that proprietary interests can make money from the
work.
5) They equate a lack of understanding of the GPL with valid
reasoning against it.
In essence, that non-proprietary interests should not be allowed to
use, adopt, improve, or make money from the work. That taxpayers
should pay for it twice. And that nobody should be able to stop
commercial entities from taking publicly funded code, they will then
close off.
Write or fax each of the Congressmen mentioned as supporting this,
and let them know they have been given bad information and that
categorically anti-opensource and anti-GPL stance will be reflected
at voting time:
Rep. Jim Davis
424 Cannon House Office Building
Washington, D.C. 20515
Phone: (202) 225-3376
Fax: (202) 225-5652
Webmail: http://www.house.gov/jimdavis/message.html
Rep. Tom Davis
306 Cannon House Office Building
Washington, D.C. 20515-4611
Phone: (202) 225-1492
Fax: (202) 225-3071
Rep. Ron Kind
1713 Longworth HOB
Washington, D.C. 20515
Phone: 202.225.5506
Fax: 202.225.5739
Rep. Adam Smith
116 Cannon House Office Building
Washington, D.C. 20515
Phone: 202-225-8901
Fax: 202-225-5893
E-Mail: http://www.house.gov/adamsmith/contact/contact.htm l
Rep. Jim Turner
208 Cannon HOB
Washington, DC 20515
Phone: (202) 225-2401
Fax: (202) 225-5955
For those without e-mail listed, email them at:
http://www.house.gov/writerep/
Here's the note to the New Democrats from Smith, Kind and J. Davis:
Support Innovation in Cybersecurity -- Sign The Attached Dear
Colleague
Deadline: Friday, October 18th
Dear New Democrat Colleague:
Attached is a letter that is being sent to Dick Clarke, the Chair of
the President's Critical Infrastructure Protection Board. As he
shapes the "National Strategy"on cybersecurity, it is important to
affirm that government R&D should be made available under
intellectual property licenses that allow for further development
and commercialization of that work. Licenses such as the General
Public License (GPL) are problematic and threaten to undermine
innovation and security. I urge you to sign this letter.
As you know, the basis of the Internet - the TCP/IP protocol - is a
result of federal R&D efforts at DARPA. The advancement and
commercialization of this research provided significant economic
growth as well as gains in productivity and efficiency.
Public-private partnerships have been hallmarks of technological
innovation and government has played a positive role in fostering
innovation by allowing the private sector to develop commercial
products from the results of publicly funded research. As such it is
important that the National Strategy reject any licenses that would
prevent or discourage commercial adoption of promising cybersecurity
technologies developed through federal R&D.
The terms of restrictive license's - such as those in the GNU or GPL
- prevent companies from adopting, improving, commercializing and
deriving profits from the software by precluding companies from
establishing commercial IP rights in any subsequent code. Thus, if
government R&D creates a security innovation under a restrictive
license, a commercial vendor will not integrate that code into its
software. So long as government research is not released under
licensing terms that restrict commercialization, publicly funded
research provides an important resource for the software industry.
New Democrats have long supported public-private partnerships --
it's important that any licenses do not compromise a company's
intellectual property rights in their own technology. I encourage
you to sign the attached letter to Mr. Clarke. If you have any
questions, please contact Mike Mullen (Rep. Jim Turner; 5-2401) or
John Mulligan (Rep. Adam Smith; 5-8901). Thank you.
Sincerely,
Adam Smith Member of Congress
Ron Kind Member of Congress
Jim Davis Member of Congress
Text of attached letter to Mr. Clarke
Congress of the United States
Washington DC 20515
October 8, 2002
Honorable Richard A. Clarke
Chair, President's Critical Infrastructure Board
The White House
Washington, DC 20500
Dear Mr. Clarke:
We are writing to submit our views on the National Strategy to
Secure Cyberspace that you circulated for comment on September 18,
2002. We believe the National Strategy should explicitly recognize
that overall cyber security will improve if federally funded
research and development is made available to Americans under
intellectual property licenses that allow for further development
and commercialization of that work product. This is a long-standing
federal principle that should be explicitly stated in the National
Strategy.
The leading example of this principle is DARPA's research in the
1970s that resulted in TCP/IP - the key set of communications
standards that form the technical basis of today's Internet. These
communications standards were made available under licensing terms
allowing their integration into commercial software, which in turn
enabled a wide range of companies to develop innovative
communication and networkingservices.
Taxpayers are still realizing a tremendous return on that federal
investment through Internet driven productivity gains, economic
growth, job creation, and individual empowerment that could not have
been predicted by the federal, academic and private sector
researchers who developed TCP/IP. However, none of these returns
would have been possible unless the research was made available
under licensing terms that allowed the private sector to
commercialize TCP/IP. Nor would the government and industry have
enjoyed the fruits of this economic activity-- fruits that have
funded additional research and development-- unless it had been made
available for commercialization.
It would be very unfortunate - indeed, couterproductive and contrary
to the public-private partnership that is at the core of the
national cyber security strategy - if companies were reluctant to
adopt promising security technologies produced by federal research
for fear that doing so may compromise their intellectual property
rights in their own technology.
For these reasons, it is essential that the National Strategy affirm
federal tradition by explicitly rejecting licenses that would
prevent or discourage commercial adoption of promising cyber
security technologies developed through federal R&D. We commend your
hard work on an issue of pressing importance, appreciate the
opportunity to participate in this process, and trust you'll
consider our views when you issue the final version of your report.
Sincerely,
(signed)
Tom Davis
(signed)
Jim Turner
Ranking Member, Reform Subcommittee on Technology
NOTE: Their letter is addressed to Mr. Clarke who has *not*
expressed support of this initiative."
From fred@bytesforall.org Wed Oct 23 05:36:45 2002
From: fred@bytesforall.org (Frederick Noronha)
Date: Wed, 23 Oct 2002 11:06:45 +0530 (IST)
Subject: [Fsf-friends] Can you trust your computer?
Message-ID:
Can you trust your computer? (Xposted)
By Richard Stallman
-
Who should your computer take its orders from? Most people think their
computers should obey them, not obey someone else. With a plan they call
"trusted computing," large media corporations (including the movie companies
and record companies), together with computer companies such as Microsoft
and Intel, are planning to make your computer obey them instead of you.
Proprietary programs have included malicious features before, but this plan
would make it universal.
Proprietary software means, fundamentally, that you don't control what it
does; you can't study the source code, or change it. It's not surprising
that clever businessmen find ways to use their control to put you at a
disadvantage. Microsoft has done this several times: one version of Windows
was designed to report to Microsoft all the software on your hard disk; a
recent "security" upgrade in Windows Media Player required users to agree to
new restrictions. But Microsoft is not alone: the KaZaa music-sharing
software is designed so that KaZaa's business partner can rent out the use
of your computer to their clients. These malicious features are often
secret, but even once you know about them it is hard to remove them, since
you don't have the source code.
In the past, these were isolated incidents. "Trusted computing" would make
it pervasive. "Treacherous computing" is a more appropriate name, because
the plan is designed to make sure your computer will systematically disobey
you. In fact, it is designed to stop your computer from functioning as a
general-purpose computer. Every operation may require explicit permission.
The technical idea underlying treacherous computing is that the computer
includes a digital encryption and signature device, and the keys are kept
secret from you. (Microsoft's version of this is called "palladium.")
Proprietary programs will use this device to control which other programs
you can run, which documents or data you can access, and what programs you
can pass them to. These programs will continually download new authorization
rules through the Internet, and impose those rules automatically on your
work. If you don't allow your computer to obtain the new rules periodically
from the Internet, some capabilities will automatically cease to function.
Of course, Hollywood and the record companies plan to use treacherous
computing for "DRM" (Digital Restrictions Management), so that downloaded
videos and music can be played only on one specified computer. Sharing will
be entirely impossible, at least using the authorized files that you would
get from those companies. You, the public, ought to have both the freedom
and the ability to share these things. (I expect that someone will find a
way to produce unencrypted versions, and to upload and share them, so DRM
will not entirely succeed, but that is no excuse for the system.)
Making sharing impossible is bad enough, but it gets worse. There are plans
to use the same facility for email and documents -- resulting in email that
disappears in two weeks, or documents that can only be read on the computers
in one company.
Imagine if you get an email from your boss telling you to do something that
you think is risky; a month later, when it backfires, you can't use the
email to show that the decision was not yours. "Getting it in writing"
doesn't protect you when the order is written in disappearing ink.
Imagine if you get an email from your boss stating a policy that is illegal
or morally outrageous, such as to shred your company's audit documents, or
to allow a dangerous threat to your country to move forward unchecked. Today
you can send this to a reporter and expose the activity. With treacherous
computing, the reporter won't be able to read the document; her computer
will refuse to obey her. Treacherous computing becomes a paradise for
corruption.
Word processors such as Microsoft Word could use treacherous computing when
they save your documents, to make sure no competing word processors can read
them. Today we must figure out the secrets of Word format by laborious
experiments in order to make free word processors read Word documents. If
Word encrypts documents using treacherous computing when saving them, the
free software community won't have a chance of developing software to read
them -- and if we could, such programs might even be forbidden by the
Digital Millennium Copyright Act.
Programs that use treacherous computing will continually download new
authorization rules through the Internet, and impose those rules
automatically on your work. If Microsoft, or the U.S. government, does not
like what you said in a document you wrote, they could post new instructions
telling all computers to refuse to let anyone read that document. Each
computer would obey when it downloads the new instructions. Your writing
would be subject to 1984-style retroactive erasure. You might be unable to
read it yourself.
You might think you can find out what nasty things a treacherous computing
application does, study how painful they are, and decide whether to accept
them. It would be short-sighted and foolish to accept, but the point is that
the deal you think you are making won't stand still. Once you come depend on
using the program, you are hooked and they know it; then they can change the
deal. Some applications will automatically download upgrades that will do
something different -- and they won't give you a choice about whether to
upgrade.
Today you can avoid being restricted by proprietary software by not using
it. If you run GNU/Linux or another free operating system, and if you avoid
installing proprietary applications on it, then you are in charge of what
your computer does. If a free program has a malicious feature, other
developers in the community will take it out, and you can use the corrected
version. You can also run free application programs and tools on non-free
operating systems; this falls short of fully giving you freedom, but many
users do it.
Treacherous computing puts the existence of free operating systems and free
applications at risk, because you may not be able to run them at all. Some
versions of treacherous computing would require the operating system to be
specifically authorized by a particular company. Free operating systems
could not be installed. Some versions of treacherous computing would require
every program to be specifically authorized by the operating system
developer. You could not run free applications on such a system. If you did
figure out how, and told someone, that could be a crime.
There are proposals already for U.S. laws that would require all computers
to support treacherous computing, and to prohibit connecting old computers
to the Internet. The CBDTPA (we call it the Consume But Don't Try
Programming Act) is one of them. But even if they don't legally force you to
switch to treacherous computing, the pressure to accept it may be enormous.
Today people often use Word format for communication, although this causes
several sorts of problems (see
http://www.gnu.org/philosophy/no-word-attachments.html). If only a
treacherous computing machine can read the latest Word documents, many
people will switch to it, if they view the situation only in terms of
individual action (take it or leave it). To oppose treacherous computing, we
must join together and confront the situation as a collective choice.
For further information about treacherous computing, see
http://www.cl.cam.ac.uk/users/rja14/tcpa-faq.html.
To block treacherous computing will require large numbers of citizens to
organize. We need your help! The Electronic Frontier Foundation
(www.eff.org) and Public Knowledge (www.publicknowledge.org) are campaigning
against treacherous computing, and so is the FSF-sponsored Digital Speech
Project (www.digitalspeech.org). Please visit these Web sites so you can
sign up to support their work.
You can also help by writing to the public affairs offices of Intel, IBM,
HP/Compaq, or anyone you have bought a computer from, explaining that you
don't want to be pressured to buy "trusted" computing systems so you don't
want them to produce any. This can bring consumer power to bear. If you do
this on your own, please send copies of your letters to the organizations
above.
Postscripts:
1. The GNU Project distributes the GNU Privacy Guard, a program that
implements public-key encryption and digital signatures, which you can use
to send secure and private email. It is useful to explore how GPG differs
from treacherous computing, and see what makes one helpful and the other so
dangerous.
When someone uses GPG to send you an encrypted document, and you use GPG to
decode it, the result is an unencrypted document that you can read, forward,
copy, and even re-encrypt to send it securely to someone else. A treacherous
computing application would let you read the words on the screen, but would
not let you produce an unencrypted document that you could use in other
ways. GPG, a free software package, makes security features available to the
users; they use it. Treacherous computing is designed to impose restrictions
on the users; it uses them.
2. Microsoft presents Palladium as a security measure, and claims that it
will protect against viruses, but this claim is evidently false. A
presentation by Microsoft Research in October 2002 stated that one of the
specifications of Palladium is that existing operating systems and
applications will continue to run; therefore, viruses will continue to be
able to do all the things that they can do today.
When Microsoft speaks of "security" in connection with Palladium, they do
not mean what we normally mean by that word: protecting your machine from
things you do not want. They mean protecting your copies of data on your
machine from access by you in ways others do not want. A slide in the
presentation listed several types of secrets Palladium could be used to
keep, including "third party secrets" and "user secrets" -- but it put "user
secrets" in quotation marks, recognizing that this is not what Palladium is
really designed for.
The presentation made frequent use of other terms that we frequently
associate with the context of security, such as "attack," "malicious code,"
"spoofing," as well as "trusted." None of them means what it normally means.
"Attack" doesn't mean someone trying to hurt you, it means you trying to
copy music. "Malicious code" means code installed by you to do what someone
else doesn't want your machine to do. "Spoofing" doesn't mean someone
fooling you, it means you fooling Palladium. And so on.
3. A previous statement by the Palladium developers stated the basic premise
that whoever developed or collected information should have total control of
how you use it. This would represent a revolutionary overturn of past ideas
of ethics and of the legal system, and create an unprecedented system of
control. The specific problems of these systems are no accident; they result
from the basic goal. It is the goal we must reject.
Copyright 2002 Richard Stallman
Verbatim copying and distribution of this entire article is permitted
without royalty in any medium provided this notice is preserved.
From nagarjun@hbcse.tifr.res.in Thu Oct 24 04:29:20 2002
From: nagarjun@hbcse.tifr.res.in (Nagarjuna G.)
Date: Thu, 24 Oct 2002 09:59:20 +0530
Subject: [Fsf-friends] [raju@linux-delhi.org: [LIG] London University doesn't permit Linux/Unix]
Message-ID: <20021024042920.GA31779@hbcse.tifr.res.in>
RMS, are you aware of this? FSF should protest.
Nagarjuna
----- Forwarded message from Raju Mathur -----
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From: Raju Mathur
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Subject: [LIG] London University doesn't permit Linux/Unix
To: ilugd@wpaa.org, linux-india-general@lists.sourceforge.net
X-AntiVirus: OK! AntiVir MailGate Version 2.0.0.0
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Interesting...
http://groups.google.com/groups?dq=&hl=en&lr=&ie=UTF-8&selm=7d532ada.0209180542.6503efb6%40posting.google.com&rnum=1&prev=/groups%3Fq%3Dg:thl1127390037d%26dq%3D%26hl%3Den%26lr%3D%26ie%3DUTF-8%26selm%3D7d532ada.0209180542.6503efb6%2540posting.google.com&frame=right
I'm moving into King's College (London University) student
accomodation at the moment. They give out LAN connections, which is
great! But to my horror, I find this text in their terms and
conditions:
> You may not run any Unix operating system since they can represent a serious
> risk to network integrity. Any student found running a Unix system (e.g.
> Linux) connected to the College network will have that system disconnected.
-- Raju
--
Raju Mathur raju@kandalaya.org http://kandalaya.org/
It is the mind that moves
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From vimalekm@vsnl.net Fri Oct 25 18:27:13 2002
From: vimalekm@vsnl.net (Vimal Joseph)
Date: Fri, 25 Oct 2002 23:57:13 +0530
Subject: [Fsf-friends] IT @ School Project
Message-ID: <20021025182713.GA387@debian>
Hello List
There are obvious errors in the article about free software in the
malayalam text book of 8th Std IT@School Project. The errors may have
crept during the translation of the English text to Malayalam. But it
cannot be allowed to happen because if allowed to, it would convey a
wrong interpretation about free software amongst the
students/teachers/other persons.
The exact malayalam text in mnglish
Line 15 : Ennal panam kodukkate mikacha software
aarkkum nalkunna oru prasthanam undu. Athanu free
software foundation. Free software prasthanathile
prashastharaya 2 peranu richard stallman um Linus
Torvaldsum
There is a movement which gives best software to
anyone without taking money, that is Free Software
Foundation. Two famous names in the free software
foundation are Richard Stallman and Linus Torvalds.
(Information technology 1, malayalam version, page 25)
It also didn't mention anything about freedom and sharing.
The English version is OK.
The exact English text
Free Software Foundation
------------------------
Many of the software available today are proprietary
in the sense that they are actually owned by the
manufacturing companies. It is illegal and hence
punishable by law to copy them or share them with
others. Also, the companies do not generally disclose
the underlying code or the method of development of
these software. So we have to buy these software at a
high cost and also forced to buy the updates the
companies bring out from time to time. So, there is a
periodic expenditure in maintaining the computer up
to date. "Free Software" is a solution to these
problems. Such software developed by the Free
Software Foundation can be copied, shared or
modified. So, they can be acquired at a low cost,
even free of cost sometimes. The movement was founded
by Richard Stallman. Another name to note is that of
Linus Torvalds.
(Information Technology 1, English version, Page 25)
The authorities at IT@School are saying that they will convert to more
free software. But I do not think it will ever happen. If one looks
at the text books for 8th Std, this becomes quite evident. One would
doubt whether it is a text book or some advertising supplement of
Microsoft and Intel. Wherever there is a picture of a microprocessor,
it is an Intel Pentium chip. The chapter on software packages shows a
logo of Windows XP. The chapter on wordprocessing shows a logo of
Microsoft Word 2000...
Should this be allowed ? This has to be fixed.....
--
Vimal
From arun@freedevelopers.net Sat Oct 26 02:09:33 2002
From: arun@freedevelopers.net (Arun M)
Date: 26 Oct 2002 07:39:33 +0530
Subject: [Fsf-friends] IT @ School Project
In-Reply-To: <20021025182713.GA387@debian>
References: <20021025182713.GA387@debian>
Message-ID: <1035598177.443.40.camel@debian-demo>
> There are obvious errors in the article about free software in the
> malayalam text book of 8th Std IT@School Project. The errors may have
> crept during the translation of the English text to Malayalam. But it
> cannot be allowed to happen because if allowed to, it would convey a
> wrong interpretation about free software amongst the
> students/teachers/other persons.
Thanks for pointing out. This is a major mistake. We will try to get it
corrected. I dont know if it has gone to press.
> The authorities at IT@School are saying that they will convert to more
> free software. But I do not think it will ever happen. If one looks
> at the text books for 8th Std, this becomes quite evident. One would
> doubt whether it is a text book or some advertising supplement of
> Microsoft and Intel. Wherever there is a picture of a microprocessor,
> it is an Intel Pentium chip. The chapter on software packages shows a
> logo of Windows XP. The chapter on wordprocessing shows a logo of
> Microsoft Word 2000...
>
> Should this be allowed ? This has to be fixed.....
I understand IT@School has decided to change this(because they also
felt, they are giving `free` Ads to Intel/MS). Again want support from
others. They would like get suggestions and alternative version.
Regards,
Arun.
From ragu@vsnl.com Sat Oct 26 03:01:30 2002
From: ragu@vsnl.com (Raghavendra Bhat)
Date: Sat, 26 Oct 2002 08:31:30 +0530
Subject: [Fsf-friends] IT @ School Project
In-Reply-To: <1035598177.443.40.camel@debian-demo>
References: <20021025182713.GA387@debian> <1035598177.443.40.camel@debian-demo>
Message-ID: <20021026030130.GA8647@gnuhead.dyndns.org>
Arun posts :
>> I dont know if it has gone to press.
Instead of being overly concerned about these mishaps going to the
Press, we should see to it that the IT@School guys correct this.
>> They would like get suggestions and alternative version.
A GNUhead could have gone in there instead of the Windows Logo, maybe
a charging GNU would have done better. Maybe our guy/s in the
Syllabus Expert Committee should have suggested these. ;-)
--
ragOO, VU2RGU :: Visit us at http://symonds.net/~fsug-kochi/
Helping to keep the Air-Waves FREE Amateur Radio
Helping to keep your Software FREE the GNU Project
Helping to keep the W W W FREE Debian GNU/${kernel}
From gnu@vsnl.net Sat Oct 26 04:08:19 2002
From: gnu@vsnl.net (Ramakrishnan M)
Date: 26 Oct 2002 00:08:19 -0400
Subject: [Fsf-friends] Re: [fsug-kochi-discuss] IT @ School Project
In-Reply-To: <20021025182713.GA387@debian>
References: <20021025182713.GA387@debian>
Message-ID: <873cqtx2oc.fsf@vsnl.net>
|| On Fri, 25 Oct 2002 23:57:13 +0530
|| Vimal Joseph wrote:
vj> Line 15 : Ennal panam kodukkate mikacha software
vj> aarkkum nalkunna oru prasthanam undu. Athanu free
vj> software foundation. Free software prasthanathile
vj> prashastharaya 2 peranu richard stallman um Linus
vj> Torvaldsum
vj> Should this be allowed ? This has to be fixed.....
We shouldn't be surprised when we see "Soujanya software vitharanam
cochin chanthayil.." (English trans: *free* software given away in cochin
market) in leading malayalam newspapers soon. :-)
--
Ramakrishnan M (http://www.hackGNU.org/)
Use Free Software (http://www.gnu.org/)
From raju@linux-delhi.org Sat Oct 26 04:40:07 2002
From: raju@linux-delhi.org (Raju Mathur)
Date: Sat, 26 Oct 2002 10:10:07 +0530
Subject: [Fsf-friends] A counter-case for government supporting GPL development
Message-ID: <15802.7335.728879.715639@mail.linux-delhi.org>
After all the MS hoopla about trying to get the US to ban the use of
GPL for publically funded software, here's a counter-argument:
http://opensource.mit.edu/papers/aigrain2.pdf
Abstract: This text provides a framework to discuss the consequences
of licensing choices that are applied to publicly funded libre
software. It discusses these choices from the angle of general public
interest and policy. It concludes that one is led to prefer GPL
copylefting licensing especially for any libre software component
whose development is publicly funded, and when it is providing
functionality that plays or may later play a critical role as part of
the common infrastructure of the information society. At the same
time, some interesting questions derive from a better understanding of
the reasons that lead some to disagree with the choice of copylefting.
Regards,
-- Raju
--
Raju Mathur raju@kandalaya.org http://kandalaya.org/
It is the mind that moves
From harilal@cusat.ac.in Sat Oct 26 08:15:04 2002
From: harilal@cusat.ac.in (Harilal)
Date: Sat, 26 Oct 2002 13:45:04 +0530
Subject: [Fsf-friends] free software../g.n.u,linex--one day training.C-dit ..details..
Message-ID: <001401c27cc7$cd8e8200$d118000a@cusat.ac.in>
This is a multi-part message in MIME format.
------=_NextPart_000_0011_01C27CF5.E33F3F80
Content-Type: text/plain;
charset="iso-8859-1"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
dear friends,
A one day freesoftware /G.N.U./linex training =
program conduct by C.dit at=20
trivandrum from next week onwards.most probably on every =
saturdays.training for
those using windows to be familiar with G.N.U/Linex is the motive.more =
over to promote
the concept of free software &to give awarness on it.those having =
basic experience in P.C
Operation can apply.Appln. form can be had from C-Dit city centre at =
tvm.(pho.no 335995)
or download from www.cdit.org
(kerala kaumudi news dated 25-10-2002)
harilal,cusat.
N.B- kindly sent this to as much as persons,you know
------=_NextPart_000_0011_01C27CF5.E33F3F80
Content-Type: text/html;
charset="iso-8859-1"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
dear friends,
&nbs=
p; =20
A one day freesoftware /G.N.U./linex training program =
conduct=20
by C.dit at
trivandrum from next week onwards.most =
probably on=20
every saturdays.training for
those using windows to be =
familiar with=20
G.N.U/Linex is the motive.more over to promote
the concept of free=20
software &to give awarness on it.those having basic experience =
in=20
P.C
Operation can apply.Appln. form can be =
had from=20
C-Dit city centre at tvm.(pho.no 335995)
or download from www.cdit.org
(kerala kaumudi news dated =
25-10-2002)
harilal,cusat.
N.B- kindly sent this to as much as =
persons,you=20
know
------=_NextPart_000_0011_01C27CF5.E33F3F80--
From harilal@cusat.ac.in Fri Oct 25 05:53:03 2002
From: harilal@cusat.ac.in (Harilal)
Date: Fri, 25 Oct 2002 11:23:03 +0530
Subject: [Fsf-friends] Fw: reply to protest on it@school
Message-ID: <001601c27bea$cd07cf40$d118000a@cusat.ac.in>
----- Original Message -----
From:
To: Harilal
Sent: Tuesday, October 22, 2002 3:47 PM
Subject: Re:
>
>
> Dear Harilal,
> It is not a virtual Surrender to MNCS. Think about the logistics
> involved. We have to train some 500 Master Trainers for training other
> teachers. All the 2000 Schools should have sufficient copies of Software.
> Then there is the need of a unified syllabus through the State, then only
> exams could be conducted in the SSLC. Think about the training alone.
> We are employing now 165 Master Trainers after giving them 15 days
> training in association with Intel. These people are to give training to
the
> 60000 teachers. What do an average person learns on IT after15 days
> training? But they are managing it because they are familiar with
> Microsoft products, which are common through out this state. What about
> the course materials for 60000 teachers? What about the Software at the
> training centres? Does the free Software foundation man a call centre
> where people can get help in our language whenever they encounter a
> problem with Hardware or Software while using the free Software? There is
> so many other logistical issues associated.
> You must understand that IT @ School was started way back
> in 2000. It is making some progress only during this year. Please note
> that I took over on 17th August 2001 and was running pillar to post to
> arrange all these logistics till April 2002. Apart from the DEOs and
others
> you may be astonished to hear the number of people with Project team,
> which is implementing this mammoth the project.
>
> Executive Director-1
> Officers-5
> Data entry operators-3
> Peon-1 and
> 165 MTs who are busy with training . We are training around 1300 high
> school teachers is around 75 training centres every two weeks.
>
> We adopt a strategy to introduce Microsoft for the 1st year then move to
> open office during 2nd year (for IT-2 text book) and introduces Linux and
> open office in 50:50 arrangement with windows and Ms office from IT-3
> textbook onwards. When sufficient groundwork is done the school level
> and teachers level we may increase the weightage of open Software in our
> curriculum. This year Prof. Krishnan (University College,
> Thiruvananthapuram). President of Trivandrum chapter Free Software
> foundation is a member of the expert Committee overseeing the
> preparation of IT-2 textbook. Need I say anything more.
>
> regards
>
>
> Biju Prabhakar
>
> Executive Director
>
> IT @ School Project
>
>
From ckra@vsnl.net Sun Oct 27 05:35:39 2002
From: ckra@vsnl.net (CK Raju)
Date: Sun, 27 Oct 2002 11:05:39 +0530
Subject: [Fsf-friends] e-Governance
Message-ID:
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Subject:
I presented a paper on the social fairness of software at the just concluded
34th Regional Science Conference at Thrissur. The core theme is attached
herewith for remarks and suggestions from members of this list.
I deliberately avoided the terminology of 'Free Software' as the audience had
been economists and planning experts.
CK Raju
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--------------Boundary-00=_FVKMUG9D5S1232HA1OBB--
From fred@bytesforall.org Sun Oct 27 06:54:19 2002
From: fred@bytesforall.org (Frederick Noronha)
Date: Sun, 27 Oct 2002 12:24:19 +0530 (IST)
Subject: [Fsf-friends] DEADLINE APPROACHING: IBM Scholar Challenge. Win an IBM ThinkPad
Message-ID:
How 'e' do you want to be?
Welcome to the IBM Linux Scholar Challenge - a chance to
test your worth against the best. The Challenge invites you to make
improvements to Linux, create usability tools or enhancements, or design
Linux applications.
Not only will you have contributed in your way to the world of Linux and
its users worldwide you could also win Linux ThinkPads, Summer 2003
Internships at IBM or Linux 16-node 'start-up' cluster.
If you are a full time student enrolled in a 2, 3 or 4 year accredited
college or university, this is an opportunity of a lifetime, a time to
put to action all those ideas you have been pottering with. Just ensure
that you register on-line at www.ibm.com/university/linuxchallenge by
October 31, 2002.
The Challenge
You select a Linux project, describe your objectives, methodology,
research, and results in a 3-page paper and submit it for evaluation
(optional project ideas are provided). You could build an Eclipse-based
WebSphere Studio plug-in Linux development or work on the development of
a Network Adapter (Ethernet) failover support by network drivers in a
standalone Linux or do something more whacked out like Fridge Fun, where
you create an embedded Linux machine front of your refrigerator.
The prizes
Not only will you have contributed in your way to the world of Linux and
its users worldwide you could also win:
- 20 Linux ThinkPads (approximately US$ 2, 500 each)
- Summer 2003 Internships at IBM 's Linux Technology Center for 3
qualified winners.
- One Linux 16-node 'start-up' cluster for the university that has the
highest overall average score of student entries (Valued at US$ 130,000)
Dates to remember
August 13 Launch of Linux Scholar Challenge in San Francisco.
Aug 13 -Oct 31 Last date for registration online at:
ibm.com/university/linuxchallenge
December 13 Last date for papers/projects submission.
Dec 16 -Dec 20 Contest Vendor validates entries & forwards to appropriate
judges.
Jan 2 -Jan 13 Judging begins 2003.
January 20 Winners announced 2003
Regards,
Sandeep Menon
Linux Business Manager,
IBM ASEAN/SA .
From baiju@freeshell.org Sun Oct 27 08:52:07 2002
From: baiju@freeshell.org (Baiju M)
Date: Sun, 27 Oct 2002 12:52:07 +0400 (SCT)
Subject: [Fsf-friends] e-Governance
In-Reply-To:
References:
Message-ID: <34834.202.88.237.246.1035708727.squirrel@otaku.freeshell.org>
> I presented a paper on the social fairness of software at the just
> concluded 34th Regional Science Conference at Thrissur. The core theme
> is attached herewith for remarks and suggestions from members of this
> list.
>
> I deliberately avoided the terminology of 'Free Software' as the
> audience had been economists and planning experts.
Could you please explain why you are not using the term 'Free Software'
here? Then where you are going to use 'Free Software" terminology?
Regards,
Baiju M
From ckra@vsnl.net Sun Oct 27 09:29:20 2002
From: ckra@vsnl.net (CK Raju)
Date: Sun, 27 Oct 2002 14:59:20 +0530
Subject: [Fsf-friends] e-Governance
In-Reply-To: <34834.202.88.237.246.1035708727.squirrel@otaku.freeshell.org>
References: <34834.202.88.237.246.1035708727.squirrel@otaku.freeshell.org>
Message-ID:
In an allotted time of 3 minutes, my brain advised me not to.
Raju
> Could you please explain why you are not using the term 'Free Software'
> here? Then where you are going to use 'Free Software" terminology?
From ckra@vsnl.net Sun Oct 27 11:08:47 2002
From: ckra@vsnl.net (CK Raju)
Date: Sun, 27 Oct 2002 16:38:47 +0530
Subject: [Fsf-friends] e-Governance
In-Reply-To: <34834.202.88.237.246.1035708727.squirrel@otaku.freeshell.org>
References: <34834.202.88.237.246.1035708727.squirrel@otaku.freeshell.org>
Message-ID:
> Could you please explain why you are not using the term 'Free Software'
> here? Then where you are going to use 'Free Software" terminology?
To a economist, I would rather try and expose limitations of closed source
technologies, so that he can agree that a debate would be healthy.
You will agree here that forcing a debate is the first step, especially when
a decision has already been taken. Moreover I didn't want to confuse the
audience with 'free software' and 'freeware/shareware' and then get into
clarifying on how something can be free, so on and so forth.
In the limited time, I felt it prudent to attack closed source technologies
than propagate freedom. That can be done only as a second step. If he takes a
capitalist view, then I will have to again tell him, that capitalist markets
have adopted 'free software' ....
The issues are endless and has every opportunity to divert their attention.
Elaborated, as I thought my first reply was too short.
CK Raju
From rms@gnu.org Sun Oct 27 23:37:27 2002
From: rms@gnu.org (Richard Stallman)
Date: Sun, 27 Oct 2002 18:37:27 -0500
Subject: [Fsf-friends] IT @ School Project
In-Reply-To: <20021025182713.GA387@debian> (message from Vimal Joseph on Fri,
25 Oct 2002 23:57:13 +0530)
References: <20021025182713.GA387@debian>
Message-ID:
The exact malayalam text in mnglish
Line 15 : Ennal panam kodukkate mikacha software
aarkkum nalkunna oru prasthanam undu. Athanu free
software foundation. Free software prasthanathile
prashastharaya 2 peranu richard stallman um Linus
Torvaldsum
Using the English words "free software" is a mistake because of the
ambiguity in the word "free". How do you say "free" (as in freedom)
in Malayalam? That is what they should use, not "free".
From gnu@vsnl.net Mon Oct 28 02:27:26 2002
From: gnu@vsnl.net (Ramakrishnan M)
Date: 27 Oct 2002 21:27:26 -0500
Subject: [Fsf-friends] RMS visiting India
Message-ID: <87pttvuwkx.fsf@vsnl.net>
Richard Stallman is visiting India. He will be in Bangalore from 31st to
5th. On 31st he is giving a talk organised by CSI. The venue is JN Tata
Auditorium Indian Institute of Science Bangalore. Time; 14.45 to 15.45 hrs.
On Nov 1st he will be talking at IT.com (I guess in Palace grounds)
He will e at Goa from Nov 6th and 7th and will be giving talks at engineering
colleges. Venue to be decided.
So mark your calenders and plan to attend them.
best regards
--
Ramakrishnan M (http://www.hackGNU.org/)
Use Free Software (http://www.gnu.org/)
From klak@giasbm01.vsnl.net.in Mon Oct 28 05:22:03 2002
From: klak@giasbm01.vsnl.net.in (Khuzaima A. Lakdawala)
Date: 28 Oct 2002 10:52:03 +0530
Subject: [Fsf-friends] e-Governance
In-Reply-To:
References:
Message-ID: <86r8ebt9xg.fsf@home.this-is-not-a-domain.in>
On Sun, 27 Oct 2002 11:05:39 +0530, CK Raju wrote:
> I presented a paper on the social fairness of software at the just
> concluded 34th Regional Science Conference at Thrissur. The core
> theme is attached herewith for remarks and suggestions from members
> of this list.
Huge drain of economic resources for maintaining efforts
That is not a good argument for countering proprietary software at
all. The archives of this list are full of comments pointing out why
this argument is flawed.
> I deliberately avoided the terminology of 'Free Software' as the
> audience had been economists and planning experts.
To such an audience we can say at the outset "Please don't consider
free software for its economic benefits but for its social benefits."
Using the term swatantra software would also help.
Regards,
--
Khuzaima
From raju@linux-delhi.org Mon Oct 28 06:27:34 2002
From: raju@linux-delhi.org (Raju Mathur)
Date: Mon, 28 Oct 2002 11:57:34 +0530
Subject: [Fsf-friends] Linux article in Hindustan Times
Message-ID: <15804.55510.975415.281634@mail.linux-delhi.org>
Apart from Niyam Bhushan's trouble-shooting column, which tells how to
make an EPABX or KTS system using Linux and talks about scanning in
Open Office, today's Hindustan Times (2002-10-28) carries a largish
article on Linux in the Tech4U (sic!) section, page 15.
The article, titled `Linux looks at a window of opportunity', is
written by Nina Mehta.
Starting off with a couple of paragraphs about the growing popularity
of Linux, the article moves on to briefly describing the history and
advantages of Linux and open source. It points out that `governments
all over the world have started adopting Linux as the preferred
desktop OS' and cites the UK police department and the Government of
Kerala as examples (no details).
Quoting various people such as RMS, Michael Robertson (CEO of
Lindows), Arindam Bose (IT head of LG India) and Javed Tapia
(Director, RH India) the article describes how Linux is free (as in
beer), more stable than Windows and as user friendly. The article
concludes with the line, `With such a cheap OS option available, PC
makers may now have to aske their customers a question Microsoft would
be mortified to hear: "Windows or Linux".'
The online text of the article is at:
http://www.hindustantimes.com/news/printedition/281002/detTEC01.shtml
Niyam's question-answer column is at:
http://www.hindustantimes.com/news/printedition/281002/detTEC04.shtml
Please send kudos and flames directly to the HT.
Regards,
-- Raju
--
Raju Mathur raju@kandalaya.org http://kandalaya.org/
It is the mind that moves
From fred@bytesforall.org Mon Oct 28 09:32:51 2002
From: fred@bytesforall.org (Frederick Noronha)
Date: Mon, 28 Oct 2002 15:02:51 +0530 (IST)
Subject: [Fsf-friends] QUERY: GNU/Linux in science and culture...
Message-ID:
Would anyone know of interesting GNU/Linux applications in the field of
science and culture in India? This is for something I'm planning
to write on. Thanks, FN
--
Frederick Noronha * Freelance Journalist * Goa * India 832.409490 / 409783
BYTESFORALL www.bytesforall.org * GNU-LINUX http://linuxinindia.pitas.com
Email fred@bytesforall.org * Mobile +9822 122436 (Goa) * Saligao Goa India
Writing with a difference... on what makes *the* difference
From arun@freedevelopers.net Mon Oct 28 17:23:19 2002
From: arun@freedevelopers.net (Arun M)
Date: 28 Oct 2002 22:53:19 +0530
Subject: [FSF India Board] Re: [Fsf-friends] IT @ School Project
In-Reply-To:
References: <20021025182713.GA387@debian>
Message-ID: <1035825803.704.41.camel@debian-demo>
:
> The exact malayalam text in mnglish
>
> Line 15 : Ennal panam kodukkate mikacha software
> aarkkum nalkunna oru prasthanam undu. Athanu free
> software foundation. Free software prasthanathile
> prashastharaya 2 peranu richard stallman um Linus
> Torvaldsum
>
> Using the English words "free software" is a mistake because of the
> ambiguity in the word "free". How do you say "free" (as in freedom)
> in Malayalam? That is what they should use, not "free".
Revised book hasn't gone to press, and correction will be made.
From ckra@vsnl.net Tue Oct 29 03:15:02 2002
From: ckra@vsnl.net (CK Raju)
Date: Tue, 29 Oct 2002 08:45:02 +0530
Subject: [Fsf-friends] e-Governance
In-Reply-To: <86r8ebt9xg.fsf@home.this-is-not-a-domain.in>
References: <86r8ebt9xg.fsf@home.this-is-not-a-domain.in>
Message-ID:
> That is not a good argument for countering proprietary software at
Thanks for suggestions. I need more of them to strengthen the theme. The
entire paper presented is at http://business.vsnl.com/kalapila/paper1.html
CK Raju
From fred@bytesforall.org Tue Oct 29 20:04:23 2002
From: fred@bytesforall.org (Frederick Noronha)
Date: Wed, 30 Oct 2002 01:34:23 +0530 (IST)
Subject: [Fsf-friends] November 6, 4 pm, Goa
Message-ID:
Please mark your diary. Richard M Stallman speaks
at Goa Engineering College Farmaguddi, 4 pm
November 6, 2002.
The Free Software Movement as we know it was founded in 1985 by
Richard M. Stallman. The basic tenets of free software are --
freedom to study, freedom to change, freedom to share or
distribute, the right to sell free software, and the principle
that the software 'source' has always to accompany binaries.
From klak@giasbm01.vsnl.net.in Wed Oct 30 07:06:20 2002
From: klak@giasbm01.vsnl.net.in (Khuzaima A. Lakdawala)
Date: 30 Oct 2002 12:36:20 +0530
Subject: [Fsf-friends] Re: Welcome message
In-Reply-To: <20021030045346.26318.qmail@linuxmail.org>
References: <20021030045346.26318.qmail@linuxmail.org>
Message-ID: <86hef44d8z.fsf@home.this-is-not-a-domain.in>
Hello,
Thanks for writing to gnu@gnu.org.in.
You can find out more about our activities on our website, fsf.org.in
or gnu.org.in. A good way to keep in touch with our activities is by
subscribing to our mailing lists (subscription information is on the
website). Please consider subscribing to fsf-friends, which is the
principal support list of FSF-India, and also to fsf-india, which is
FSF India's announcement list.
-- gnu@gnu.org.in
On Wed, 30 Oct 2002 09:53:46 +0500, "SEPSIT KANNUR" wrote:
> Hello,
> Sepsit is a registered society working for the enhancement of Free
> software in Keralam.We had already contacted GNU and they redirected
> us to You.It's a pleasure to know that FSF India is headed in
> Keralam.We arev currently developing Software in GPL'd tools on
> GNU/Linux Platform.We are also providing necessary guidelines to firms
> that wishes to move to GPL.We wish to know more about FSF India and
> its activities .We have a tie-up with Open Software Solutions
> Industrial Co -Operative Society Limited,Ernakulam,which is working
> for the enhancement of free software and related matters.Kindly give
> necessary Information.
>
> From Social Entrepreneurship Promotion Society on Information
> Technology (SEPSIT), Reg No 463/2002, Dinesh Software Park, Kannur,
> Keralam, India - 670002, Telephone : 0497-712965
>
> --
>
> Powered by Outblaze
>
>
From klak@giasbm01.vsnl.net.in Wed Oct 30 07:03:49 2002
From: klak@giasbm01.vsnl.net.in (Khuzaima A. Lakdawala)
Date: 30 Oct 2002 12:33:49 +0530
Subject: [Fsf-friends] Fwd: Welcome message
Message-ID: <86k7k04dd6.fsf@home.this-is-not-a-domain.in>
--=-=-=
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From: "SEPSIT KANNUR"
To: gnu@gnu.org.in
Date: Wed, 30 Oct 2002 09:53:46 +0500
Subject: Welcome message
X-Originating-Ip: 61.1.248.167
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Hello,
Sepsit is a registered society working for the enhancement of Free software in Keralam.We had already contacted GNU and they redirected us to You.It's a pleasure to know that FSF India is headed in Keralam.We arev currently developing Software in GPL'd tools on GNU/Linux Platform.We are also providing necessary guidelines to firms that wishes to move to GPL.We wish to know more about FSF India and its activities .We have a tie-up with Open Software Solutions Industrial Co -Operative Society Limited,Ernakulam,which is working for the enhancement of free software and related matters.Kindly give necessary Information.
From
Social Entrepreneurship Promotion Society on Information Technology (SEPSIT),
Reg No 463/2002,
Dinesh Software Park,
Kannur,
Keralam,
India - 670002,
Telephone : 0497-712965
--
Powered by Outblaze
--=-=-=
--
Khuzaima A. Lakdawala
--=-=-=--
From paivakil@vsnl.net Wed Oct 30 16:44:38 2002
From: paivakil@vsnl.net (Mahesh T Pai)
Date: Wed, 30 Oct 2002 22:14:38 +0530
Subject: [fsug-kochi-discuss] Re: [Fsf-friends] IT @ School Project
In-Reply-To: <20021025182713.GA387@debian>
References: <20021025182713.GA387@debian>
Message-ID: <3DC00C76.80408@vsnl.net>
Richard Stallman wrote:
> Using the English words "free software" is a mistake because of the
> ambiguity in the word "free". How do you say "free" (as in freedom)
> in Malayalam? That is what they should use, not "free".
Swatantrayam, swatantrata, swatantra, refer to freedom, the state of
being free and free (as in freedom) respectively; and this word is
used in *most* Indian Languages`.
Sowjanya is the term for "free as in beer". This might not hold true
for all Indian languages - in Hindi, for example, the work "mupth" or
something like that.
Regards,
Mahesh T Pai.
From paivakil@vsnl.net Wed Oct 30 16:36:29 2002
From: paivakil@vsnl.net (Mahesh T Pai)
Date: Wed, 30 Oct 2002 22:06:29 +0530
Subject: [Fsf-friends] e-Governance
In-Reply-To:
References:
Message-ID: <3DC00A8D.6080406@vsnl.net>
CK Raju wrote:
> I deliberately avoided the terminology of 'Free Software' as the
> audience had been economists and planning experts.
Raju, you have a point there. I feel that they understand the term
'swatantrayam' better, and a few days back, I saw a reference to the
term 'free as in enterprise' in one of those news letters from
sourceforge.net.
I think that you can use the concept of 'swatantrayam' better.
Regards,
Mahesh T Pai.
From fred@bytesforall.org Thu Oct 31 07:48:08 2002
From: fred@bytesforall.org (Frederick Noronha)
Date: Thu, 31 Oct 2002 13:18:08 +0530 (IST)
Subject: [Fsf-friends] NEWS: Stallman at IITB... dangers of software patents
Message-ID:
Message: 1
From: "Srinath S"
To:
Date: Wed, 30 Oct 2002 11:41:09 +0530
Subject: [Indic-computing-users] Richard Stallman on the Dangers of Software Patents
Dear All,
I'm sorry that I have been a dormant member of Indic-computing list. There
is very little I can contribute to Indic computing per se.
In case you are interested, Richard Stallman (of GNU fame) is giving a
speech on the Danger of Software Patents at IIIT Bangalore on Nov 2nd. The
talk is between 11:30 -- 13:00 hrs. You can register for the talk at this
URL http://osl.iiitb.ac.in/stallman-register.php
Hope this would be of help in your research and your projects.
Best Regards
Srinath Srinivasa
Faculty member IIIT-B
From fred@bytesforall.org Thu Oct 31 06:58:05 2002
From: fred@bytesforall.org (Frederick Noronha)
Date: Thu, 31 Oct 2002 12:28:05 +0530 (IST)
Subject: [Fsf-friends] (no subject)
Message-ID:
Can we post a more detailed update to the various mailing lists.
One confirmation: Goa should read Nov 5 evening-Nov 7 noon (not 6-7).
Talk on Nov 6 at 4 pm, Goa Engineering College, Farmaguddi, Ponda.
Also planning an interaction with Goa Chambers of Commerce and Industry
and the CM. FN
PS: We need to be publicising this early. Can friends from Bangalore give
an update of programmes there too?
* * * * * * * * * * *
This is from the fsf-friends mailing list....
----------------------------------------------------------------------------
Richard Stallman is visiting India. He will be in Bangalore from 31st to
5th. On 31st he is giving a talk organised by CSI. The venue is JN Tata
Auditorium Indian Institute of Science Bangalore. Time; 14.45 to 15.45 hrs.
On Nov 1st he will be talking at IT.com (I guess in Palace grounds)
He will e at Goa from Nov 6th and 7th and will be giving talks at
engineering colleges. Venue to be decided.
So mark your calenders and plan to attend them.
----------------------------------------------------------------------------
Regards,
Amol Hatwar
--__--__--
From baiju@freeshell.org Thu Oct 31 16:06:15 2002
From: baiju@freeshell.org (baiju)
Date: Thu, 31 Oct 2002 21:36:15 +0530
Subject: [Fsf-friends] Fwd: [smc-devel] Re: [malayalamlinux] Looking for Malayalam Unicode text
Message-ID: <200210312136.15883.baiju@freeshell.org>
Mahesh T Pai has completed an unofficial translation of GNU Public Licens=
e :
http://in.geocities.com/paivakil/freecommunity
Regards,
Baiju M
---------- Forwarded Message ----------
Subject: [smc-devel] Re: [malayalamlinux] Looking for Malayalam Unicode t=
ext
Date: Thu, 31 Oct 2002 14:02:42 +0530
From: Mahesh T Pai
To: Rajkumar S , smc-devel@nongnu.org
Rajkumar S wrote:
> Hello,
>
>
> Any one having some Malayalam Unicode text?
Try it on the GPL. Here it is
Rajkumar had posted the original message to
malayalamlinux@yahoogroups.com, but since it has moved to
smc-devel@nongnu, my reply comes to this group. Hope it is all right.
This is how I created this file. Original was file created in iLeap,
and 'saved as' ISCII text from .lp2 format. From ISCII format, it
converted to varamozhi text. (athaayathu ithu pOle). From varamozhi
text, converted to unicode, using varamozhi. Varamozhi is not able to
convert direct from ISCII to unicode - it hangs on win98.
The Malayalam translation of the GPL will go on line at
http://in.geocities.com/paivakil/freecommunity within a few hours
definitely before 00.00 hours, November 1.
With regards,
Mahesh T Pai.
-------------------------------------------------------
From unmadindu@Softhome.net Thu Oct 31 17:41:35 2002
From: unmadindu@Softhome.net (Sayamindu Dasgupta)
Date: 31 Oct 2002 23:11:35 +0530
Subject: [Fsf-friends] regarding the Akruti Fonts
Message-ID: <1036086139.1990.75.camel@localhost.localdomain>
Hi all,
Work has started on the Akruti Bengali fonts, and Dr Anirban Mitra
has already developed a beta OTF using the
glyphs.
The GPOS tables are still incomplete, and some of the yuktakshars are
still missing.
I will upload the fonts asap in the download sections at
www.nongnu.org/freebangfont/
-regards-
sdg